119 Comments

"because propaganda only works if you don’t know you’re being propagandized."

And there you have it. So many people still think these news agencies are legit.

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founding

Sadly, I know most of mainstream media is propaganda and I still find myself trapped by it now and then. One of the reasons I love Caitlin, I don't have to constantly check every word for truth. Comments are another story hahahha.

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Agreed. Comments here are too well populated with retired WASPs demanding the obedient servants they were promised, failed life coaches seeking a new groove, and mystic hustlers looking for an edge.

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Alot of these news oulets are I think not necessarily entirely for propagandizing the day-to-day working class and lower middle class Americans. I think many of them are targeted at the swamp creatures themselves, a kind of affirmation and echo chamber. Remember there are millions of these elites, they're not a small audience. They like their puff pieces that assure them of their insane plans.

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I no longer think the media or government institutions speak much to people like me. They appear to talk behind me - to the owners.

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Good points.

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Yeah, but can they figure 2+2 = 4? You can only be propagandized so far -unless walking backwards comes naturally to you. Many Americans are worried about their next meal, never mind getting help before they become deathly ill. Can they be seriously worried about China/Russia? Do they really believe the Lindsey Grahams and other dirt specks have some solution?

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Sep 6, 2023·edited Sep 6, 2023

I think part of it is how the propagandists skillfully manipulate people's anger and frustration. Given how stressful life can be for so many ordinary Americans these days (making sure you get the rent paid, worrying about medical bills, not having enough time off to actually enjoy life from a job that becomes your life, etc.) the propagandists then figure out a way to channel that anger into targets that serve the interests of the oligarchs: like immigrants, or the Russian boogy man, or anger channeled at religion, or government in general - where goverment becomes so evil in the minds of so many "angry" overworked Americans, they then throw out the baby with the bathwater, and don't see any of the good a non-corrupt government might be able to produce for them.

I think some of this anger even goes to the very top in DC - maybe an unconscious boiling anger of those in power. Where they use their anger to become corrupt - not give a damn regarding the people they are suppose to actually represent. Instead they only serve themselves and the donor power interests that give them the money to be politicians in DC. It may also be an existential anger - given the mileau we find ourselves in - where religion or spirituality no longer plays the center role in many people's lives as much (church attendance goes down every decade) - where (even if it were a bunch of hokey, which sometimes it was) people at least had something more to believe in then live out their lives as miserable serfs for some wealthy Lord. Now, more and more people must live out their wage slave lives - without even believing there might be something more than just a life of exploitation and daily labor. Heck, they want to raise the retirement age yet again for Americans. Work until you drop dead - is suppose to be the ideal life? A fulfilling life? One of the most common refrains from people on their deathbeds, is they feel that they worked too much. That they should have tried enjoying life a little more. Of course, some never really had the chance to enjoy life much.

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You're right of course: the exploiters are taking advantage of the general malaise, insecurity and outright fear to forward their agenda. And only an idiot could believe that illegitimate, ineffective government in the service of the self-serving - points to no government whatever as solution!

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Yes, but we should not forget that think tanks were created and financed by the rich to transform our thinking into the neoliberal rationality. And that project was extremely successful.

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Ridiculously successful, given how many people blame money itself as the source of the problem, rather than private control over the means of production.

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If people want to know what Money really is, they could read Ellen Browns amazing book, "Web of Debt" and follow her columns.

Including: More Banks to Fail? Not in North Dakota. https://scheerpost.com/2023/08/31/ellen-brown-more-banks-to-fail-not-in-north-dakota/

Another expose on the immorality of the American Banksters. If American's want to know why they are oppressed, it is because private capital controls the US dollar. Until that control is reestablished, the American Economy will be further raped and plundered until there is nothing left but an empty shell of an empire that a stiff breeze will blow away.

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They would be much better served reading David Graeber's *Debt: The First 5000 Years* rather than another whiny purification narrative about how capitalism and the state would work if only the Prots had more authoritarian control. It's another edition of the same lie they've been shitting out for hundreds of years.

https://davidgraeber.org/articles/manners-deference-and-private-property-or-elements-for-a-general-theory-of-hierarchy/ (see the English Puritans section)

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I call Bullshit on your characterization of Brown's position(s).

I found Graeber's explanation of hierarchy to be boring and obvious.

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Well, some people need it explained to them because they actually believe "power" is a real thing.

In your case however I hoped you would read the particular section on "English Puritans" and their insipid love for authoritarian aristocracy, and also hints of their sick Pietist perfectionism. Apparently it was wasted, since you unironically posted up the thread crying for the "American Economy" like some epic beast, for fuck's sake! Is it in the room with you right now? Should I clap harder to keep the lie alive just so you can parasitize off people based on false values? Why are you so shameless about your psychotic delusions and your love of myths (i.e. lies)?

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Taiwan is a part of China, so how can China "invade" Taiwan? Taiwan is not a separate country from China.

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It's the same old story. Every treaty, accord, agreement or promise ever made by this country's government since the first violation of the first treaty with the Indians has been broken. The rest of the world laughs when the US says "We Promise"! because they know to look at the hand with the knife in it not the one holding out the lie!

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They are linked financially. There's no reason for "invasion."

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founding

As with Ukraine, there will be a time when so many weapons are pored into the country the Chinese central gov. will have to respond as with Russia. There will be no choice or so I think. When NATO started talking about building a base, I am surprised something grand scale didn't happen.

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Think tanks were part of the neoliberal agenda to push government out of way and make them superfluous. Now we see the end result.

It is always hard to separate the boys from their toys. It appears juvenile delinquency is rampant in the halls of power starting in the White House and the guy who eats too many ice cones.

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Juvenile delinquency is rampant in the halls of Congress!

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"So here’s a billionaire-owned news rag marketing a Lockheed Martin product endorsed by a Lockheed Martin-sponsored think tank and disguising it as journalism, while also normalizing the idea of fighting and winning a war against the Chinese military using technology that could lead to nuclear war. Just another day in the world of empire propaganda."

Empire propaganda... Just another way to make more money for the billionaires of the US MIC. I guess mainstream journalism should be re-catagorized as "advertising" since that's all it really is. Maybe you could call it "public relations" but most certainly isn't providing useful or truthful information to the general populace.

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Mainstream journalism retagged as advertising for the MISC .

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What does MISC stand for?

Typo?

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I should let Cirza speak, but I believe this means Military Industrial Security Complex.

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I am thinking this might be an even scarier version of the old one!?

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Leave it to The Telegraph and their special scribe David Axe (is this even a real person?) to ejaculate in pale feverish ecstasy over this spanking new JISM missile delivery system, coming to a "Theater of War Porn" very far away from you--but at least you can jerk-off to the Review. Maybe Mr Axe should review the opening sequence of "Dr Strangelove," instead? Unconscious self-parody knows no bounds with the Think Tank set, apparently...

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This sounds like a script for a tiktok or a youtube short. Should attract a lot of viewers. I'd certainly be one of them.

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I don't know: might violate "Terms of Service." However, the phrase "TikTokThinkTank" might be kind of catchy...

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Yeah, the script's "ejaculate in pale feverish ecstasy" might get them perked up. They'll demand to know whether "pale" is an appropriate adjective.

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Ha!

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Postmodernism was little more than a yawn in academia, but it raised a stink in popular culture because it popularized the notions that objectivity is a myth, and that all truths are subjective. This subverted the public relations approach to managing the perceptions and opinions of the unwashed.

Today we are in the throes of the emperor being undressed in slow motion. Language is being slaughtered in the process. “Authoritarian” is a label for governments that don’t use the smoke and mirrors associated with Madison Avenue. “Democracy” is reserved for the government that features the best institutions that money can buy.

There is no colloquial term for the tyranny of corporations, but I believe that it’s just a matter of time.

The writings of Caitlin and a growing number committed journalists are the most inspiring works of our current era.

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"Emotivism is a meta-ethical view that claims that ethical sentences do not express propositions but emotional attitudes." Understanding that public life consists entirely of the performance of myth makes the permanence and necessity of institutions that much less real.

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I'm so offended by the constant prattling on about war with China. So casual, like war is no big deal, even though it's all about killing people. And marketing these stupid weapons and the conflicts of interest involved. Pure propaganda. It's hard to believe people lap it up.

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There are more serious defects in this sort of writing. Mr. Axe does not seem to understand the first thing about military strategy. He envisions incinerating Taiwan as a response to an improbable Chinese invasion. The serious military strategist, contemplating an aggressive move, must then ask, "Then what?" The presumed enemy is not going to be passive or unarmed. The state employing the missiles is not going to be invulnerable -- far from it.

Someone said that for the United States, it might be useful to imagine that there are dozens of submarines belonging to some hostile power armed with nuclear missiles a few miles from Los Angeles, Seattle, New York.

Another important aspect of the advertised missiles is that they are doubtless going to be very expensive, and many will have to be bought, because they will be impossible to test under working conditions. So they will form a nearly bottomless wealth sink for whoever pays for them.

Maybe this is the sort of thing you want to convey to your representatives. They surely don't care about your moralizations.

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I rush to be first to comment, hopefully something related to Caitlin's post. Then send folks over to my substack.

Only I don't have a substack. But I managed to be one of the first.

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I don't have a substack either. But somehow, Substack has appointed one for me. Now I am getting followers--I don't know what they are following because I am not a Substack writer and I rarely comment on any of the Substack articles. I am having trouble trying to figure out how Substack works.

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At some point while signing up you must have clicked "Create your substack". Which was not necessary if you didn't plan on writing anything.

Check your profile and see whether you can remove it.

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russian_bot, thank you.

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founding

I plan and do write it's just not interesting enough to share. My son who reluctantly edits for me, " You not only need an editor, you need a writer" and so I write into the void. Dark Matter Zombies, Dirty Dozen to Mars, Run to the Light, ................

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founding

They are waiting for treasure : )

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You're pretty quick on the draw. You would have fit in just fine at Dodge city.

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I'd need to get substacked to be fully equipped.

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There is an open revolving door between the US government, think tanks and weapons manufacturers. Typically when a policy wonk in the government leaves office they enter a think tank or a defense contractor and are given lucrative sinecures. That way the government works in synch with weapons purveyors and their think tank sycophants. Think of it as a giant conglomerate working to ensure " total spectrum domination" of the world economic and military spheres, all cloaked under "defending freedom". That the public is clueless only helps perpetuate their nefarious deeds.

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Think tanks are, in fact, foreign policy lobbying firms. The people who work at think tanks and push for particular policies are properly called lobbyists. The fact that these are often viewed and treated differently from lobbies is a scandal.

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For all the funds that the US of aggression is wasting on lie based wars - like a drunken sailor on shore leave - it doesn't even need to go into debt in order to fund the MIC as it could simply purchase whatever with the confetti dollar - However that would most certainly eat into the profit margin of the insatiably greedy MIC - Think Blackrock & Vanguard - who happen to have contracts to supply with ISDS provisions - which means that they could sue for loss of their own and imagined financial forecast in case there's no war.

Perpetual wars ensure that the Neoziocon warmongers [Think of the Kagans and the generals sitting on the board of privately owned defense contractors] retain control over their fact free political narrative while at the other end of the political spectrum true peace candidates will have as much chance of winning the US presidency as a snowflake descending into hell.

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This is the deal they are presently burying us in again with Biden making a law to fund Ukraine like Israel forever. Since there isn't anywhere left on the planet to go maybe we could convince Elon to let us gather all these warmongers up and put them on a rocket but don't send it to Mars send it into the Sun!

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Nearing the end of the second world war the financial elite were taxed over 90% of their income - now they borrow from them and promise to repay with interest.

Blinken is about to give Ukraine another Billion.

9-11 was used to launch PNAC which is about numerous things - all of them are alarming,

One of them is the pursuit of the Oded Yinon plan aka greater Israel which requires her neighboring nations to be carved up into smaller more easily manipulated states.

Then there's Kiev being viewed as a second Jerusalem - [Kiev is the new Jerusalem -

Ukraine as 'Big Israel' and the Heavenly Jerusalem Project - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4IKThcTt8_M ]

This has been out for some time - [Zelensky is on record for intending to create a Israeli style apartheid state in Ukraine - see - Israel’s Secret Plan for a «Second Israel» in Ukraine -Strategic Culture Foundation - https://strategic-culture.org/news/2014/12/03/israel-secret-plan-for-second-israel-in-ukraine/

Grayzone - Zelensky and NATO plan to transform post-war Ukraine into ‘a big Israel 2022] - https://thegrayzone.com/2022/09/17/zelensky-nato-ukraine-big-israel/

As for sending war monger to the sun....

If we're able to round up all the war mongers and give them the Due process that they've been denying their victims then it would appear that we've figured out how to hold them accountable - Here's the problem - after all this time we've still not figured out how to join forces and hold our sadistic tyrannical overlords accountable.

Collectively, we're scared of the soulless bullies in uniforms.

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I sure do agree with you on that! It is an interesting thing about uniforms for sure. I always thought it was such a laugh to see a little guy in a little country in a uniform worthy of a peacock! So many medals he has to waddle!

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For the uniforms to side with the people would be a game changer however even though politicians are supposedly under oath and all that - In the end - our governments simply do not serve our interests but that of the financial elite and by that we ought to place the Davos crowd under the microscope - the steps of government house appear to serve as stepping stones up the corporate ladder.

Then there's the revolving door between the DOD and the MIC.

https://www.globalresearch.ca/the-military-industrial-complex-a-capitalist-system-rune-amuck/5315597

That and much more.

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It is a living nightmare for us all.

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Indeed - One way or another we still need to turn this around - It be nice to have the masses on our side however before that can happen the MSM needs to start publishing brilliant writings such as the author of this page. [highly unlikely.]

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Hard to find investigative journalists.

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No it isn't. Matt Taibbi, Max Blumenthal, Aaron Mate, Pepe Escobar, Moon of Alabama, Brian Berletic, Richard Wolff, Scott Ritter, Chris Hedges, even Jimmy Dore.

Now one could get hung up on what "investigative" means or what "journalist" means but here you have alternate news sources that often debunk the MSM. If you can't find them, you aren't looking for them.

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founding

OH, I thought I was reading something I wrote, wow. That is the same list I follow and support with $$$$$$$$$

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It is an incomplete list. Very incomplete.

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Guess I should have been more specific. I was referring to the state run media.

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Truth can't be sold. Only lies can be sold. Eventually you will tire of your heroic piety and understand that capitalism is slavery and you've merely entitled yourself to be a slaver.

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This is the mindset of this Mass Murdering scum. "After massive destruction of the Navy" right that's not a big deal. I will tell you what the first time someone offed/sacrificed one of my friends or coworkers and then said for the rest of us to go in after or else I can tell you where the next bullet would go. This blatant disregard for the lives of people to just throw away for killing more people is insanity. This is what I just showed for that treasonous bitch in Illinois! She will sacrifice American lives just so they can kill more Ukrainians! There can be no question as to what these people are all about. There is absolutely no way to butter this burnt toast to make it seem like a normal piece of bread!

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Sep 6, 2023·edited Sep 6, 2023

I mean - you want a good definition of evil? When you sacrifice human life for your own personal profit and gain. How many have already died in Ukraine? A few hundred thousand??

We live in a sick world right now.

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They're sacrificing life for the Christian cosmos of total slavery, which is (ostensibly) more important than individuals. Then again, so are you and other "socialist" PMCs.

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I am not sure what you actually mean by this and I will have to look up "PMC" since I have no idea what that is? But I can tell you outright I am an atheist and don't buy any "controlling bullshit" and when it comes to "Socialist" I don't belong to any group I just know right from wrong and hurt when other people hurt. I can't speak for Jamenta but since this is tied to my comment I thought I should clarify myself.

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founding

Professional Managerial Class. It's used as a point of class perspective. I am guilty as well now and then. Mercedes Communist.

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OK I thought it was "Private Military Contractor" but this still is a tough one for me to fall into.

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Barbara and John Ehrenreich's theory of the "new middle class" phenomenon that was of interest in Marxist scholarship about 40-70 years ago.

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From where I am at I do not see a "Middle Class". You are either poor or rich or richer. They have wiped out the middle class and for the poor literally bled the last dime out of every resource left to them. I used to recycle to get some decent money and now it is barely worth the time. Now I need the money. That is just one thing. The poor get put into the slave system of prison which is completely intentional. I will say I don't travel any longer and have not been out around the country for at least 6 to 8 years but when I did I went through ghost towns. Towns totally boarded up. Maybe at the time of this "theory" you refer to there was a case to be made but today I don't see it.

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The Marxian conception of class refers to a particular relation to the economic foundations of society. The liberal idea most people think of, where consumption levels determine classes, isn't really useful for analysis of production relations.

Thinking historically, around the turn of the century new relations to the means of production arose, and Marxists spent the 1950s-1980s trying to theorize the nature of new entity(ies) that had appeared in capitalism. The Ehrenreichs "define the Professional-Managerial Class as consisting of salaried mental workers who do not own the means of production and whose major function in the social division of labor may be described broadly as the reproduction of capitalist culture and capitalist class relations," who constitute something like 10-25% of positions in the West. They offer a historical-material analysis of the class, a theory of its development, its contradictions, antagonisms, and so on, all very neat and theoretical.

Here's the article, serialized in two parts. https://repository.library.brown.edu/studio/collections/id_594/?q=professional+managerial+class&search-scope=id_bdr%3A26166

TBH, middle classes shouldn't exist. They inevitably create a lower class and and worsen the miserable atrocity of their existence, and, according to the PMC theory, keep capitalism in place. It's better to have rid of them (as an institution and as a social relation, not as humans) and let workers deal with capital directly, on our terms.

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They are death-worshipers, one might even say devil-worshipers, and this should be made explicit.

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Sep 6, 2023·edited Sep 6, 2023

It ain't just the MSM and "think tanks".

Next time you hear about another war porn movie or TV show, remember that the relationships between the Pentagon and CIA on the one paw, and Hollywood on the other, are all well-documented.

There's a reason that the Navy lets movies be shot using Navy ships and aircraft, for example.

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Tom Cruise anyone! Exactly. Even Oliver Stone has to get approval.

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