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Diana van Eyk's avatar

It surprises me that more people aren't passionate about the truth. In relationships, in the news they read, with themselves. If we don't know the truth of a situation, how can we make informed decisions?

"In a healthy society ordinary members of the public would have enshrined privacy protections against the government, and any governmental systems would be as transparent as air."

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Anthony Dunn's avatar

"It's discouraging to think how many people are shocked by honesty and how few by deceit." Noel Coward

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Rukshana Afia's avatar

Noel Coward was very wise as well as funny .

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Chang Chokaski's avatar

>>"It surprises me that more people aren't passionate about the truth"

It doesn't surprise me the least bit. Practically speaking, people seem to be interested in truth primarily when it works in their favor (in whatever context). It is easy to observe how people sway away from truth when the truth doesn't serve their purposes/needs/wants.

>>"If we don't know the truth of a situation, how can we make informed decisions?"

But that's exactly what the "power elite" want. They DON'T want us to make informed decisions. They want us to listen to them.

Also, do people really make informed decisions (regardless of whether they know the truth or not)? It seems to be that people make decisions based on various factors (truth/data being just one of them), including the outcome they wish to make happen/materialize (regardless of whether it is based on truth or not).

And I'm not even going to open the can of worms that is "what is the truth"? (as there is great variation here).

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Bob - Enough's avatar

The majority of people do not want to "rock the boat" with questioning what they are being told, most could not cope with the truth. They just want to carry on with their "carefree" and content lifestyles, spending their salaries or social security money on what they think makes the content and happy. We saw it regards the plandemic and these people will definitely see it over the coming years... if they are not seeing it already.

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Professor Smartass's avatar

We have a bias to think the current status quo is the way things have always been and always will be when, in fact, someone worked hard to create those conditions for their own benefit.

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Bob - Enough's avatar

Totally agree; we have been fully manipulated by their brainwashing and their deletion of culture / religious belief and many other things. Now so many are just muppets and puppets that are so easily manipulated by the "powers that be". Fear is their greatest weapon, confusion it's No. 2...

Let me ask you what may sound like a daft question.

Q = "When did we become so manipulated / brainwashed to be afraid so much of dying ?" .... just have a think about that and try and say; fit it into the plandemic, the new threats of nuclear war etc....

PS Bet our Grandparents and predecessors would not put up with the nonsense that most will put up with now.

The World is a stage and it is all lies and bllx.

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Rukshana Afia's avatar

My grandparents had difficult lives and were just trying to get by . I do not think they had much choice about "putting up with nonsense" .

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Chang Chokaski's avatar

I was with you until the word "plandemic". You lost me after that.

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David Latin's avatar

Sadly, even in societies like Australia, where Privacy has become so obsessive officially:

we know that it doesn't mean much, always ways for the government to get around the official and do what is possible.

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Howard Pearce - Libertarian's avatar

I've read about the down fall of real liberalism in Australia

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Roslyn Ross's avatar

Australia suffers the same as other Western nations in that there are no true liberal parties let alone conservative and the Labor lot have gone mad Green. That is not unique to Australia.

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Indu Abeysekara's avatar

What do you mean Roslyn Ross, That " the Labor lot have gone mad Green"?

I would consider it a good thing if they have!

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Roslyn Ross's avatar

I mean the Greens on many issues, such as the profit and power-driven climate change agenda are extremists. Madness is being hysterically pro-Renewables, which cannot as yet and perhaps never, provide base load power and pushing to close down energy resources which can. Madness is pushing to divide Australia into us and them, giving greater power to anyone with a bit of Aboriginal ancestry.

But that is a digression and off-topic.

But no-one gets it all wrong and some of them have done the right thing in terms of speaking out against Israel's genocide and aggression.

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David Latin's avatar

But, if we don't close our eyes to reality, allowing global temperatures (a sign of climate instability) to overshoot and allow future generations and any possible new technologies to take care of it, is just avoiding the existential problem!

We can all feel happy like the ostrich, until life become unsustainable!!

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Howard Pearce - Libertarian's avatar

I consider the Libertarian Party liberal if you have one there

However, it is dedicated to the concept of Freedom of Association in social interaction over the state as part of liberalism. It rejects what I call state-mandated liberalism - an attempt to setup liberal society with mandates by the state

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Howard Pearce - Libertarian's avatar

it's the sign of a society that has been totally politicized by its parties which citizens must take some of the blame3

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Howard Pearce - Libertarian's avatar

some people simply do not want to hear the truth about reality

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Spunty's avatar

I seriously doubt whether Western journalists would report the truth even if they were allowed into Gaza. The empire owns the MSM which have shown themselves to be corporate lickspittles.

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Rob Roy's avatar

Spunty, the majority of reporters in Gaza who were murdered by the IDF were there to report the facts. MSM "reporters" either aren't there and get their "news" from theIsraelis, or are embedded with the IDF, and in other wars, say brought about by the USA, embedded with the American troops.

As for the truth, we can say for certain, we get a daily dose of it from Caitlin.

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Francis/Clare's avatar

Instagram has plenty of reports, too.

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Howard Pearce - Libertarian's avatar

ALL "legal" news coming out of Gaza must be reviewed by the Israeli state for "validity".

SOme middle eastern news/ reporters have tried to avoid that and have had people killed by the Israeli state.

This has been going on for a while if the U.S. press even reports it

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Vin LoPresti's avatar

I get a lot of dirty looks for this attitude but this is why the Holidays overwhelm me --- more and denser advertising means a greater profusion of lies, more prevarication per minute. It offends me because it's so opposite to what my father taught me.

Power and and transparency correlated: that sounds like nirvana.

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denise ward's avatar

It's up to us to implement alternatives. I feel the same about Christmas. I could almost throw up when I hear the carols in the stores, sung so syrupy to get you to buy more stuff. Same with seeing the Christmas lights all over the place, a big fat finger to pollution. As long as they have their lights, they couldn't give a bugger about pollution. We could start databases of people who actually do the work and make the effort to keep a low pollution footprint. This could be the start of how disparate people who simply want to live in the truth can anchor themselves to a common project. That would just be the start.

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Roslyn Ross's avatar

Christmas and its power, exists in ways no other religious festival does, because it is both a religious, Christian and secular celebration. Hindu, Muslim, Buddhist countries celebrate Christmas and that is a unifying factor.

The carols are beautiful and if people buy more stuff that is a choice they make. Do not blame the carols. Christmas lights are also beautiful and there is far more pollution from advertising lights which are on around the world, all the time.

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Marci Sudlow's avatar

I love the lights and music. It is a bright spot in otherwise dreary cold winter. I'm not religious, but I ascribe to the Pagan love of nature with a decorated tree, and the return of light following the Winter Solstice. My Christmas lights (LEDs) stay lit 24/7 until Valentines Day (another holiday, followed by St Patrick's day which is yet another holiday).

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JennyStokes's avatar

Has the tree been cut down? Is it a fake tree?

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Vin LoPresti's avatar

Best lights are those decorating the evergreen trees and bushes growing naturally in front of folks' houses because it also celebrates the beauty of those natural trees by crowning them with lights.

Here in the US southwest, it's mostly Junipers and Pinon pines, but they're as beautiful as the more classic fir and spruce.

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JennyStokes's avatar

Love all trees.

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Marci Sudlow's avatar

A real spruce or fir tree grown right here in Vermont, in a bucket of water and rocks. Lights stay on until it begins to lose its needles; then it goes up into my woods on a brush pile for the critters to enjoy. Other xmas lights stay up longer.

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denise ward's avatar

I love the lights too but there has to be times where our love of something isn't the priority. And if we did't consume electricity, maybe we'd find another way of lighting the trees, and that spurs ingenuity.

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Marci Sudlow's avatar

A string of LED lights uses a miniscule amount of electricity, and most power in my state comes from renewables.

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denise ward's avatar

That's great.

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Professor Smartass's avatar

There would be more atheists if they had better songs.

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martin's avatar

christmas is a feast of heightened consumption, nothing more, nothing less.

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Francis/Clare's avatar

Christmas is a community and family celebration. The classical music is gorgeous. Like many things, it has its high form and its lower forms. Seek the beauty.

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Vin LoPresti's avatar

I'd agree with you. High form represented by music like Handel's Messiah, not necessarily the Christian overtones, but the power of the music itself - pipe organs, large chorus of mixed voices major chords, almost inevitably uplifting. Low form" "Hurry hurry, special seasonal offer, buy now."

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Rukshana Afia's avatar

Should people of other faiths be forced to join in ?

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Francis/Clare's avatar

Of course not.

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gypsy33's avatar

Agree 100% Martin. It truly amazes me that non-Christians celebrate Christmas. WTF? Somebody correct me if I’m wrong, but did the birth of Jesus indicate maxing out one’s credit cards?

As a Pagan, I neither give nor accept “Christmas” gifts.

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Roslyn Ross's avatar

It is more than that even if for some it is as you say.

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martin's avatar

heightened consumption and heightened narrative, i stand corrected.

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Rukshana Afia's avatar

I am Muslim and would never celebrate Christmas if there wasn't this hassle about it . Is it really unifying when people threaten you for not having Christmas decorations and lights up ?

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Francis/Clare's avatar

That's horrible.

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gypsy33's avatar

Hi Rukshana

I read your post yesterday and have been thinking about it. What kind of jerk would bully a non-Christian for not putting up the trappings of a holiday that their religion doesn’t celebrate???

Believe me darlin’, I’ve been through it myself. Years ago when I realized that I was pagan ( and always have been) I experienced the same thing. Conversations would go something like this:

I don’t celebrate Christmas. I celebrate the Solstice.

Why?

Because I’m Pagan.

You’re not Pagan.

Yes, I am.

No you’re not!

Yes, I AM.

My nominally Catholic family has accepted this. It’s my husband’s Baptist family that has a problem with it. They still send me religious Christmas cards 🙄

Long story short, Rukshana: don’t allow ANYONE to pressure you into something you’d rather not do!

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Rukshana Afia's avatar

We tend to try and celebrate the solstice - not because it is a pagan festival but because as far North as we are (N. Yorkshire , UK) - The shortest day really is the turning of the year . In a LeGuin novel it is called Sunreturn which seems ver appropriate .

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Rukshana Afia's avatar

In the Northern hemisphere . South of the equator Christmas actually occurs in the Summer !

I am Muslim and only ceebrate Christmas because it is pretty heavy if you don't ! I have had plenty of hassle about this .

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Vin LoPresti's avatar

How terribly sad --- but unsurprising. I apologize for all the idiot Christians who practice discrimination, while calling it the season of love and joy. Pure hypocrisy.

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Rukshana Afia's avatar

Actually I have had far less hassle from people of other faiths (including Pagan!) than from eg most varieties of Christian or the more strident atheists .

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Rukshana Afia's avatar

Some Muslims do celebrate or get around it - my mother used to write "Greetings of the Season" in cards which I thought was really quite good !

My experience is that there is more hassle from non-believers than actual practising Christians - except a few born-again types . Many just dislike the fact that we don't drink alcohol !

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Francis/Clare's avatar

Where do you live? I've never even heard of that before.

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Roslyn Ross's avatar

Yes, north, south have different seasons but it is still Christmas.

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Marianna Chambless's avatar

I believe your comment that there is far more pollution from advertising lights, but when I see some of the outdoor displays in our town, my first thought, after being awed, is the contribution to the degradation of the environment. Yet I love the lights, the display makes me happy, and I FEEL what I used to feel as a kid. I love the carols too, pop or traditional or classical, even though my husband flees to work in the yard whenever I put them on. And the season seems to unify people in some kind of joy or happiness, just as basketball season here does. I love Christmas, even as I'm getting too old to get the ornaments down from the attic and I feel considerable anxiety with all there is to do. So many things we do adversely affect the environment or hasten climate change. I guess we have to be ever mindful of our actions, and conduct a personal cost-benefit analysis - what is the cost of the joy we're seeking, not just for us but for the world?

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Rukshana Afia's avatar

An elderly friend of mine attached real red candles to the end of branches of her Christmas tree - a real one , of course . She was told of for it but this was unreasonable . She was born around WW1 and knew perfectly well how to do all this safely !

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gypsy33's avatar

THANK YOU for saying this, Denise! I’ve seen peoples’ yards so excessively lit that there electric bill must run $1000 for the month of December.

They’re just telling the public, Look at me! Aren’t I festive? Don’t you feel the Christmas Spirit seeing what I’ve wrought here?

All in spite of, as you’ve noted, the fact that we’re supposed to be leaving a smaller carbon footprint. The rules don’t apply to these Special Folks, I suppose.

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Roslyn Ross's avatar

And why has the word Holidays, which means vacation, replaced the word Christmas in the US? Because of Jewish influence. Why don't Americans talk about Christmas anymore? Holidays is a crap term which means nothing, which was and is of course, the whole point.

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Marci Sudlow's avatar

'Holiday' here in the US means a day celebrating an event, often marked by suspension from work or school on that day. I think the word is synonymous with 'vacation' primarily in the UK.

Personally I often wish others happy holidays because that encompasses both Christmas and New Years, as well as the Winter Solstice. Additionally it includes those who celebrate different winter holidays. Holidays are happy days, and they are not 'nothing.'

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Roslyn Ross's avatar

Holiday in the UK and Australia means a public holiday or to go on holidays, which is leave. Vacation is the term Americans use.

Americans once talked about Christmas and now call it Holidays even though they don't even get holidays for Christmas beyond a day. In fact Americans get very few public holidays and the shortest annual leave or vacation of any developed nation.

Holidays is a new term invented in the US, so they did not have to say Christmas and those behind it were not most Americans or Christians.

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Francis/Clare's avatar

"The word "holiday" comes from the Old English word hāligdæg, which is a combination of the words hālig ("holy") and dæg ("day"):

Origin: The word was first recorded in 950 AD, and the first recorded spelling of "holiday" was in 1460 AD.

Meaning: The word originally referred to special religious days.

Pronunciation: The word was pronounced as "holy day" until the 16th century.

Middle English meaning: During the Middle English period, the word took on a new meaning as "a day when commoners were exempt from labor".

The meaning of "holiday" varies by region:

United States

In the United States, the word refers to days of rest or celebration that are nationally, religiously, or culturally observed.

United Kingdom and other Commonwealth nations

In these countries, the word can refer to a period of time when someone has leave from their duties. This time is usually set aside for rest, travel, or recreational activities.

Holidays can include: Religious observances, Patriotic observances, Celebrations of ethnic pride, Commemoration of historic events, and Birthdays of national heroes."

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Roslyn Ross's avatar

Yes, I know the origin of holiday. It is English. Serfs and servants could be given time off on Holy Days.

I have spent a lot of time in the US over 40 years and have family and friends there. The use of the word Holiday for Christmas, working to exclude the use of the word Christmas for Christmas is relatively recent. I remember when Christmas was used and not Holiday in the US.

In the vernacular, HOLIDAY is a common word meaning nothing but a day off or public holiday, something Americans rarely get. HOLIDAY does not mean Christmas and neither for centuries has it meant Holy Day or religious day. It is the word most English speakers use for annual leave, or going away, for which Americans use the term vacation.

The writing out of the word Christmas to be replaced by Holidays has happened in recent decades as any of us old enough to remember well know. You are not going to find out why that happened but there were movements led by certain religious groups to oust Christmas for the generic Holidays.

It has infiltrated slightly in Australia but most people hate the term and use Christmas. In my seven decades, it was always Christmas and/or Festive Season and holidays were something you took as leave. The entrenchment of meaningless Holidays for Christmas let us hope, remains an American habit.

And certainly you can find snippet references to Holidays in the US as a general term for Christmas and New Year, but the replacement of Christmas by Holidays is historically recent.

Merry Christmas to all and a Happy New Year says far more than Happy Holidays.

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Mary Johnson's avatar

Thank you! I was about to say this. I’m American, and in the U.S., the word does generally refer to celebrations with a religious/spiritual component.

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Roslyn Ross's avatar

Let me put it this way:

Say Holiday to someone and what comes to their mind?

Say Christmas to someone and what comes to their mind?

In the US some people might think Christmas when they hear Holiday but in the rest of the world they will not. Christmas means something in all cultures and religions in ways Holidays does not and never will.

Holiday for Christmas is cancel culture at its silliest.

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Marci Sudlow's avatar

"Holiday(s)" is not a new term. It has been around at least as long as I have and I'm in my 70s. The word "Christmas" refers to a specific holiday and it is still in use without any possibility of going extinct.

Paid holidays along with paid family leave, paid vacation time, and safe working conditions being increasingly denied to many American workers is a separate, and far more worrying issue. This is a real issue, unlike the semantics of what to call any particular holiday.

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Roslyn Ross's avatar

Yes Americans have the worst worker conditions in the developed world and the least annual leave and fewest public holidays. To make it worse they also have the lowest minimum wage and some of the worst wage conditions of any Western nation. The richest country has the poorest and most poorly paid people.

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Susan Mercurio's avatar

I feel sorry for you, if you have to think that "holidays" is a crap term. You don't seem to have much awareness that many people celebrate different holidays in the winter than Christmas. Your circle of friends must be limited.

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gypsy33's avatar

Thank you Susan.

I know people mean well when they wish me “Merry Christmas” ( which I don’t celebrate). I smile, thank them, and wish them Happy Solstice.

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Roslyn Ross's avatar

Using the term Holidays when the celebration is Christmas is a copout. Christmas is Christmas and it is a universal celebration both secular and Christian. It is the only religious celebration which functions in such a way and embraces everyone.

Those who celebrate things like Diwali and Hannukah, along with dozens of other religious celebrations are few. Christmas is Christmas and it is the biggest celebration of the year, whether secular or not.

Holidays is a banal, generic, meaningless term. Festive season would be much better if people want to pretend Christmas does not exist.

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Susan Mercurio's avatar

You're stuck in your Christian bubble.

Get over it.

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Indu Abeysekara's avatar

I agree, Susan Mercurio, What's all this got to do with Caitlin's serious discourse on Truth!

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Roslyn Ross's avatar

Just a reminder that words matter and the correct use of words matters even more. Merry Christmas to you too.

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Susan Mercurio's avatar

👎

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Rukshana Afia's avatar

Holiday is a shortening of 'Holy Day' which is a well-known fact , at least in Great Britain .

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Roslyn Ross's avatar

Of course it is and it came from the fact that serfs and servants would get a day off for Holy Days in centuries past. That became holiday, which then became leave and vacation time as the Americans would say. We go on holidays and we celebrate Christmas.

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Francis/Clare's avatar

Holidays are official days off in the US. Using Happy Holidays is intended to acknowledge the diversity of beliefs. Since the 50s, American society has become more aware of and respectful toward those who, to be honest, are not white or Christian. Tragically, a supreme con artist has encouraged those who wish to return to the days when white Christian patriarchal families were dominant. You always could say Merry Christmas and you still can. I've never used Happy Holidays, but in writing this comment I've convinced myself to start. Happy Holidays and a New Year filled with love, peace and happiness to all!

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Roslyn Ross's avatar

Yes, I know the story of how, why and when there was a push to bury Christmas under the meaningless Happy Holidays.

Thankfully this practice remains in North America although sadly the Canadians seem to have taken it up.

By all means say happy holidays, but it means nothing because the word holidays means nothing.

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Marianna Chambless's avatar

I think the point of this discourse is to remind us that we use the word "holiday" now to be more inclusive, as we use so many words euphemistically these days to avoid giving offense to one group or another. I often say to people "Have a nice holiday," which isn't as satisfying as saying "Merry Christmas," and, honestly, I think it has more to do with not wanting to APPEAR insensitive than with trying to be sensitive. I have lived in several countries, most of which were Christian, India the exception, and spoke the language in a couple, and we always adapted our words to ones acceptable to the culture THERE. So, why should it be considered culturally insensitive for an American, in the US, to extend the greeting of "Merry Christmas", an English tradition, to whomever they meet on the street or elsewhere, with the expectation that the person being greeted will respond with whatever suits them?

And a point of clarification. It was not the 50s that saw the emergence of greater sensitivity to people from different cultures, at least not where I grew up. It has been a fairly recent concern, and it manifests in the variety of ways one must speak and act to be considered politically correct.

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Roslyn Ross's avatar

The push for so-called diversity did not come from Indians who celebrate Diwali around the end of the year and who do also celebrate Christmas, but from some Jews who do not celebrate Christmas and wanted its power diminished.

Christmas is Christmas. A time of giving and caring even for those who are not Christians. That is important. The word Holidays does not denote giving or caring, it just means time off work, and neither does it conjure up the wonderful traditions of Christmas which delight billions around the world.

Yes, you are correct, the burying of Christmas in the US under the generic term Holidays is recent, a couple of decades and it is Wokeism gone mad and it is political correctness.

Christmas is inclusive because it is Christmas and that is why it is celebrated in symbol and actions in Hindu, Muslim, Buddhist as well as Christian countries. Some Jews even celebrate Christmas but many, perhaps most do not and they were instrumental in the push in the US to get rid of Christmas.

Political correctness is a curse and diversity is not about pretending that everyone cares about all religious celebrations or that all should have the same standing in every country. The celebration of Christmas is special and its symbols and tradition of giving and caring is unique to it because the giving and caring is for everyone and it needs to be maintained.

Merry Christmas is still said by most people outside of North America and long may it be so. Christ consciousness is woven together with rich ancient spiritual and religious traditions at Christmas and it benefits us all.

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Francis/Clare's avatar

Ok, the 60s in California. I think you can say whatever makes you happy. As I said, I think I'll embrace Have a Happy Holiday because the desire to go back to a 50s and earlier where the standard was the patriarchal white Christian family is deplorable, cruel, and unenlightened. If Native Americans, blacks post-slavery, and Hispanics had been treated in a manner equal to whites, US society would be completely different today, with far more education and far less poverty and crime. And if wage inequality had not been enshrined by our system to the point of absurdity, we wouldn't have masses of unhoused people.

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Susan T's avatar

The world does know the truth about what the IDF is doing in Palestine. But the people who could stop it are more concerned with money and power, or what the empire will do to them if they don't go along. They aren't going to stop anything. Anyone who can read, anyone who is on social media or who knows someone else who is on social media knows the truth about what the IDF is doing. The mainstream media may not report on the total truth of what is going on, but even they, every now and then, let some tiny piece of truth slip out. Anyone who speaks out against what Israel is doing is accused of being antisemitic and they lose their jobs and/or their reputations. We need more than truth. We need people with power who care about the truth.

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denise ward's avatar

No we need to stop funding them because that makes us culpable too. Waiting for someone to do the work for us, or some "leader" is only going to mean we're toast.

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Susan T's avatar

I do my best not to fund billionaires. It is difficult with taxes though. I am not waiting for anyone to do the work for me. I speak out against this genocide whenever and wherever I can. Easy to say just stop funding them, take control etc. Do you have a plan?

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denise ward's avatar

Yes I do have a plan. It is about to be upgraded and can be read here: https://deniseward.substack.com/p/architecture-for-the-new-epoch

I am about to upgrade it and add another "prong" to a three pronged strategy.

Time is becoming "off the essence" as this was put out long ago and we should have gotten started on the three points but now I want to add another one and we can start that right away. It is creating a database of individuals' pollution footprint and a rewards system for those who keep a low one.

The other three are in a nutshell:

1. Adopt a secondary calendar which we start citing right away (if we choose)

2. Adopt an alternative currency which we recommend called "Cannacoin" (for cannabis)

3. Adopt a quality consensus system to determine courses of action or disputes.

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Susan Mercurio's avatar

I have another idea for you: learn Modern Monetary Theory (MMT). The economists who created it decided to look at how the monetary system actually works, instead of theorizing about how it should work in a perfect system.

The currency is created by Congress, every time they pass an appropriations bill. Some people try to say, "It just comes out of thin air?" to downplay the truth. Yes, it comes out of thin air, the same place that laws come from.

Congress spends the money out into the economy. It spreads around and eventually gets to your employer. You get paid, and put of that, you pay your taxes.

See? Taxes come at the END of the process, not at the beginning.

Yes, it was true in the Middle Ages that the peasants paid to the landlord, but those were the days when the peasants actually created something of value. THEY tilled the fields. THEY went down mines. Then they had something to give to the landlord. They gave him a percentage. The world doesn't work like that any more. The government CREATES the money!

Those who say that the government needs your tax money to do anything are living in the Middle Ages.

You can find out about MMT from The Rogue Scholar, Real Progressives, Macro'n Cheese, or MMT Mondays on YouTube. Stephanie Kelton also has several great videos on YouTube about it.

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Susan T's avatar

This video talks about the complexities of this situation, living with it, stopping it, even talking about it. https://www.youtube.com/watch?app=desktop&v=bUQWwo5a4t4

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Chang Chokaski's avatar

>>"We need more than truth. We need people with power who care about the truth."

Well said Susan T!

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Paula's avatar

I appreciate you, Caitlan as a person, and without much money, I have done lots of research since the late 70's. Yes, that gives away my age. And why everyone should be angry about a vaccine that targeted our elderly. Call them what you want, the elderly fucking remember JFK, MLK, Malcom X, Fred Hampton and some few even remember what true history tells us of our treatment of the indigenous population Columbus encountered and immediately thought to enslave; such was his mindset and its in his journals.

Fred Hampton, only 21 years young when he was executed, and yes, I choose that word because of his wonderful ability to bring black and poor white together and of course if we could only organize as he was doing, we are the majority in the world. Blacks, white poor, others too that are like us, make the majority of the entire world. Those "they" are going to use our race, our poverty, our immigration status against us and many other "sections" of humanity. If only humanity could see itself as a whole as Fred Hampton almost did, as some others, if only we did not allow the "they" to divide us and thereby conquer our most beautiful tendencies, we could be a great world, great singular nations allowed their own beliefs, great peace where we trade goods in an equitable fashion and no one is allowed to take any by force. Get out of the box of your thinking that you did not create but you must recognize in order to get out of the box. Much love to all the people just like us with mothers, fathers, sons, daughters and great ancestors. Do give a look to the "simple" beliefs of the indigenous. You might find in their simplicity, a way to move forward? with much more respect for our "great creator" whose living ecosystem was meant for all life forms.

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denise ward's avatar

This may astound you but it is us that is to blame almost totally. We are the ones who do the bidding of billionaires. We are the ones who use their money system, which enslaves all of us, we are the ones who obey their laws and actually enforce them on others like us (pecking order much?) Who are the people arresting whistleblowers and people who have stuck their neck out for humanity (eg: Dr Rashid Buttar and many others)? The people are us, who do these things, sometimes our own family members. But we give them a pass because it's "their job". We have to confront our own thinking before we can get to the sleepy masses. The way we are towards each other, for example, never blocking or censoring, never charging for our work to humanity in truth, never advertising in this field of dedication some product that will enrich you. How can anyone who lives to bring forth the truth use this platform to monetarily enrich themselves? Some writers won't let anyone comment unless they pay a fee. We can't be doing the same things that this paradigm accepts. We have to go beyond it. The most important thing now is getting humanity through this hiccup (or series of hiccups)

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Anthony Dunn's avatar

“Monsters exist, but they are too few in number to be truly dangerous. More dangerous are the common men, the functionaries ready to believe and to act without asking questions.”

― Primo Levi

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Patrick Powers's avatar

Do they believe or do they just need a paycheck?

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denise ward's avatar

They don't think about it and don't want to face it. Yes, it all depends on a paycheck for them because money makes whores out of people. That's the way it's designed.

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Paula's avatar

No, it is not us, it’s those who control our learning and information. Sorry you don’t know that, but as a retired educator, I am well aware. Maybe look up a book that may be older than you are, called Dumbing Down America.

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denise ward's avatar

I don't need to look in a book to justify my observations. Books are many and say many things but they do not live our lives for us. It is only a perception that makes you think the education system is to blame. There is a tendency in the program that conditions us, to point the finger at the bigger entity, to blame the faceless entities. But when it's broken down, those entities exist because people work in them, people make them what they are. "Ordinary" people like you and me. Ordinary people fight the wars, arrest each other, and force things on each other. But they blame Trump or Biden or the police or the law or any other faceless culprit while always giving "the people" a pass. This is how the program continues to replicate.

It is again "we the people's" responsibility to not put our children into those gulags. But instead of taking them out, parents either do nothing or complain that the education system is faulty (which it most definitely is). Instead of finding a better way, finding others who think the same and organizing something that is more favorable for their children, they blame the top of the hierarchy when it is the bottom of the hierarchy that holds the top up. But that is ignored consistently. Therefore the problem will continue to occur because you can't fix a problem when you haven't identified it.

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Paula's avatar

So why don’t you know about the USS Maine or the USS Liberty or that five US presidents have been assassinated for attempting to create National Banks. It is quite obvious you don’t read books. Good luck.

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denise ward's avatar

Well I do read books and yes read all those men's stories. But I'm looking forward not backward lest I get hit in the face by a wrecking ball. So much is happening that has never happened before. Just like in finance prospectuses, they always say past results do not guarantee future results. You didn't address my point however, you just got riled up because I insulted books. I prescribe that we ignore all that, it will continue to go on in the background, but we don't have to give it any more energy. Our energy needs to go to building the new civilization. Otherwise humans are not going to make it. We have to get out of the idea that we must be governed. Adults govern themselves. Children need to be governed but not adults because adults cannot govern adults, it's a preposterous idea. I'm sure no books say that though.

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Paula's avatar

Girl, looking backwards helps us look forwards. Many say you can’t understand the present unless you know the past.

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Paula's avatar

You say we, I say not me. I am working with groups of people that want state and national banks like the Bank of North Dakota. A very healthy banking system and revenues are generally used for in-state programs. Are very flexible unlike FEMA when disasters strike their citizens.

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denise ward's avatar

I used to be for the bank of ND, what they call public banks, but we don't need banks AT ALL. We don't need banks, period. Why do we need banks to move numbers from one account to another when we have the tools right in our hand that can do that? We have to do away with these old-fashioned, pre-digital concepts, they no longer serve us. I think we should be engaged in building local currencies alongside the national one as a safety net should the government give us another sh!tshow.

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Paula's avatar

Appreciate your perspective, but not a fan of digital. Real currencies as in what keeps us alive is preferable and sustainable community food systems. None of that is digitizable. Trading centers and farmers markets and community building projects that banks could help with as well as communities. However, I am no expert in the area. See this and listen closely to the last person testifying. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WC6-dJGq9HU

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denise ward's avatar

Thanks but I have studied this subject extensively. Banks are not necessary. All currencies are not "real", they are simply made up, like the days of the week. But they help us have more choices. We are too populous to live without recording transactions however we could live like that again if we automated the distribution system and manufactured locally and had local sourced energy. Which is quite doable if it weren't for the obstructionists (ie: government). There is no need for banking anymore. We shouldn't even be using bank-issued money as it impedes our growth and advancement and keeps us down. We don't need saddles anymore either because we have cars. But with banking and government, we continue to act like we're in the "old days" and do things the same even though they are irrelevant now.

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Paula's avatar

You should argue with the retired CEO of Goldman Sachs about it. She’s on the board of the National Banking coalition. People who know it all already are impossible to talk to and seem to have closed minds. Digital stinks. Too much room for control of our money. in my opinion. Plus computers and the energy it takes to run a bank of them is not ecologically sustainable. Give me a newspaper that actually reports the news, a radio, a landline telephone, and a good book about any subject that interests me and a home town bank that isn’t gouging us with interest rates any day.

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Brother🍓 Strawberry's avatar

“How can anyone who lives to bring forth the truth use this platform to monetarily enrich themselves?”!!! Agree with You 10,000% on that!

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Chang Chokaski's avatar

>>"And why everyone should be angry about a vaccine that targeted our elderly."

And which vaccine was that? I don't recall ANY in the history of human kind. And if you mean the COVID vaccines, they were CRUCIAL in saving the lives of MANY elderly members of our society.

Here's a good example of TRUTH (that Caitlin writes about in the article). The TRUTH is that the Covid vaccines saved many MILLIONS of lives on planet earth (mostly the lives of older people as those were the ones most vulnerable to the virus).

So why is it that many people REFUSE to believe this truth? Is it trust issues? (i.e. trusting those in authority or capitalists or the pharma industry, or whatever) Is it a lack of being able to understand the science? Is it misinformation/disinformation?

People say they want the truth. But often when they are presented with the truth, they refuse to accept it as the truth. They want THEIR truth, not THE truth (most people can't even agree on a "common" truth - everyone seems to have their own version of it).

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Chris N's avatar

My current understanding is that the position of Covid “vaccines” saving millions of lives is based on modeling, not actual data. You will recall that the early modelling indicated that Covid had a mortality rate in excess of 3%. That turned out to be tremendously exaggerated yet the fear narratives did not abate for a long time.

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Chang Chokaski's avatar

2 different points.

(1) You're absolutely RIGHT on the second point. In fact, the real mortality rate (accounting for different age groups, co-morbidities, immune systems, etc.) for Covid is more around 0.0009% (according to Wikipedia, out of every 1,000,000 people that contracted Covid, 885 died - based on world-wide data) [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/COVID-19_pandemic_death_rates_by_country]

What this means is: (a) The REAL RISK of Covid was way OVERBLOWN and extremely EXAGGERATED! (b) The Risk was exaggerated for many reasons - fear, uncertainty, panic, etc. IMHO, one reason for exaggerating the "risk of Covid" and "extreme fear porn" that we saw and experienced was for PROFITS and to feed the machinery of Capitalist (Pharma companies, other corporations and businesses, etc.). If there WASN'T this opportunity to "make money" over the "Covid crisis", I doubt the authoritarian responses of many governments would have been so severe.

(2) >>"My current understanding is that the position of Covid “vaccines” saving millions of lives is based on modeling, not actual data"

This is inaccurate. Part of the reason there were much fewer deaths was because of the Vaccines (I'm not considering things like masking, social distancing, lockdowns, etc. which I feel were nebulous solutions without much rigorous scientific data to back up such solutions). BUT Vaccinces are a completely different ball game. Granted that there is much variation amongst the different vaccines AND the efficacy of vaccines was "over-promised" and "under-delivered". Inspite of that, there is REAL EVIDENCE (from trials and real-world data) of the impact of the vaccines in ameliorating the effects of the virus.

One point people fail to consider is this -> the people that benefitted the most from the vaccines were the elderly (70+ age group), people with co-morbidities, people with naturally weak immune systems, etc. The vaccines (for Covid) were not as effective for healthy, young people (especially kids under 18, etc.)

So, I would say that the vaccines saved millions of lives (in the categories and age-groups most vulnerable to the virus), and not as much for other categories/samples of the population (that were not as vulnerable to the virus).

IMHO, one of the LARGEST policy mistakes that most Governments made was to NOT separate the categories sufficiently, and to use a "one-size-fits-all" approach instead of "laser-targeted and pragmatic/efficient" approaches.

Much more can be said (and already has) on the subject, so I'll stop here.

(PS: I made an error in my use of statistics and logic above: the data I quoted was the mortality WITH vaccines. Hence, the real mortalitiy rate of the VIRUS (without the vaccines) would have been higher).

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Paula's avatar

Maybe you should read others. And it’s a fact that Amish children take no vaccines and are the healthiest children in the USA. We are free to believe what we want and no one will ever stick a needle in my arm again. The last time made my life long heart murmur go berserk.

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Chang Chokaski's avatar

>>"Maybe you should read others."

Maybe you should study "critical thinking". It will do wonders for your ability to anaylze things and have more accurate opinions on things.

Here are some recommendations:

(1) Conspirituality: How New Age Conspiracy Theories Became a Health Threat (https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/62874269-conspirituality)

(2) The Art of Thinking Clearly (https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/16248196-the-art-of-thinking-clearly)

(3) A Field Guide to Lies: Critical Thinking with Statistics and the Scientific Method (https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/54879347-a-field-guide-to-lies)

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Paula's avatar

My favorite coffee cup: “I identify as a conspiracy theorist. My pronouns are, I told you so.

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Brother🍓 Strawberry's avatar

THERE IS ABSOLUTELY NO PROOF OR SCIENTIFIC EVIDENCE THAT THE EXPERIMENTAL INJECTION SAVED A SINGLE LIFE. THERE IS NO SCIENTIFIC PROOF THAT A “Covid” “virus” or “pandemic” EVER EXISTED OR HAPPENED. Flaws In The Coronavirus Pandemic Theory http://saveelsobrante.net/CoronavirusPanic.pdf

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Chang Chokaski's avatar

Continue living in your "MAKE BELIEVE WORLD" and false narratives. I doubt there is much hope for someone "with your thinking" to ever understand (much less know) truth and facts and evidence-based medicine and understanding of science.

I wish you luck in your existence, and you will probably need it if another pandemic/epidemic arises that is more serious than Covid (which was mild comparatively against other viruses/bacterium from past pandemics)

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Brother🍓 Strawberry's avatar

What exactly is “MAKE BELIEVE” about my world where in order for something to be considered true it must be demonstrated so with science, research, fact and verifiable data? The term “MAKE BELIEVE” is more applicable to your fear and worship of theoretical phantoms.

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Chang Chokaski's avatar

Sorry, Brother Strawberry - I am unable to continue discussing such topics with you - I am not interested in debunking your "conspiracy theories". There is much on the internet that has ALREADY DEBUNKED everything you say - it is up to you whether you have the logic, reasoning, and critical thinking skills to understand and process the facts (and all the nuances involved).

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Paula's avatar

I think the "make believe" is you, Chang, pretending to be an intellectual and denying many of us our own personal experience of dead relatives in our lives, the stories of others, and the fact that science is not supporting you, that other countries are banning the vaccines and that the spike protein is being found in the blood of the vaccinated four years later. You are the one who needs more critical thinking skills.

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Brother🍓 Strawberry's avatar

Yet you keep coming back for more. It is as if you enjoy having your willful ignorance exposed and humiliated. Are you some weird sort of masochist who enjoys being humiliated?

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Brother🍓 Strawberry's avatar

Just admit what is clear to anyone following this discussion that you are lacking in knowledge of the subject we are discussing and that you have lost this debate. Bye now.

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Brother🍓 Strawberry's avatar

To claim that something has already been “debunked” but fail to demonstrate such is the height of arrogant ignorance. Or is it ignorant arrogance? Perhaps both.

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Brother🍓 Strawberry's avatar

Actually, you are unable to respond, challenge or refute the science, extensively researched fact and verifiable data that refutes the unquestioning blind faith you have in phantoms. My only “belief system” is based in science, extensively researched fact and verifiable data. Meanwhile you are the one fearful of phantoms and clinging to failed fairy tales.

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Brother🍓 Strawberry's avatar

When, where, how and by who was the “sars-cov2” causative agent obtained from a patient suffering illness, reduced to a purified isolate required to establish Gold Standard for diagnostic testing and demonstrated to cause the identical illness when infecting a new host?

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Brother🍓 Strawberry's avatar

Before i waste any more of my time on you demonstrate your comprehension of the PCR technology this entire “covid” “pandemic” relied on to exist. Then demonstrate your comprehension of the basic common sense rules for proving an agent responsible for or capable of causing disease.

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Chang Chokaski's avatar

You are LOST, Brother Strawberry. Hope you are able to find your way out of the rabbit hole that you are in. It would be futile for me to attempt to rectificy the errors in your narratives and logic/critical thinking - you likely need professional help to de-program yourself from the "belief systems" that you have been indoctrinated by.

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Brother🍓 Strawberry's avatar

Wait. Let me guess. Will bet you beLIEve in a phantom retrovirus called “hiv” that causes sexually transmitted epidemic immune failure disease that when theorized into existence was predicted to “explode into general population” infecting “1 in 5 heterosexual Americans by 1990” and “decimating” the population of Africa where the “hiv” phantom was theorized to have originated and spread heterosexually despite the fact that forty years later the “epidemic” and the “hiv” phantom proposed as causal remains primarily restricted to original risk groups testing and treating/pre-treating for the often undetectable phantom and the only people dying of “AIDS” these days are those who follow prescribed treatment for that often undetectable “hiv” phantom while in the forty years since the “hiv” THEORY predicted “decimation” of the African population that population has despite unending famine, drought, endemic disease and genocidal conflicts MORE THAN DOUBLED SINCE PREDICTION OF ITS DEMISE. How do you explain this?

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Chang Chokaski's avatar

See my earlier response to your comment.

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Susan Mercurio's avatar

Not only do the elderly remember MLK and Bobby Kennedy, but the young don't seem to realize that we were the 60s generation, the counter-culture. They just don't connect the dots.

Do you really think that I came into the world with grey hair and ossified opinions?

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Francis/Clare's avatar

Yes, that's a beautiful vision.

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Roslyn Ross's avatar

The truth is that Zionist Israel is a taint on humanity and on Judaism and it always has been. It really is time to eradicate the State of Hate.

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Judy Bancroft's avatar

And how pray, do we do this? The AIPAC run US certainly won’t “eradicate” them when it’s funding them. And now look at them in ‘disputed territory’ in Syria … for f’s sake …. more settlements/land grab ….wasted no time.

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Roslyn Ross's avatar

At the end of the day politicians must answer to their voters. The voice of the public must grow to such a degree that politicians think about their own people and not the demands of a foreign state.

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Phil Castelucci's avatar

"Three things cannot be long hidden.The sun,the moon,and the truth."

Buddha

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denise ward's avatar

We cannot sit by and just let it come to us. We have to bring it forward.

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SW's avatar

“Then you will know the truth and the truth will set you free.” John 8:32

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Chang Chokaski's avatar

IMHO, that is the worst/most inaccurate saying ever. Too much to expand on that,. including what is meant by "free" and in what context.

And if it were remotely true, and if people wanted to be free (as most people say they do), wouldn't most people be speaking the truth? And since they often don't, does that mean they don't want to be free?

That saying does not reflect the "reality of life" (though it does sound good as a saying and makes one feel all good and virtuous inside).

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Claire Drouault's avatar

Expansion is how we obfuscate truth. Truth is what it is. Twist it and reinterpret it to support any agenda and it becomes a lie. Lies aren’t truth. Liars can’t be trusted even when they tell the truth.

Power that abuses truth isn’t owed truth. “With great power comes great responsibility.” Power that refuses to take responsibility is corrupt. Corrupt power lies. It blames others for its own abuses. It punishes those who tell the truth, forcing them to lie in self defense, corrupting them.

Power is not entitled to truth.

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Stephen Walker's avatar

“Above all, don't lie to yourself. The man who lies to himself and listens to his own lie comes to such a pass that he cannot distinguish the truth within him, or around him, and so loses all respect for himself and for others. And having no respect he ceases to love, and in order to occupy and distract himself without love he gives way to passions and coarse pleasures, and sinks to bestiality in his vices, all from continual lying to other men and to himself.”

- Fyodor Dostoevsky, The Brothers Karamazov (1880), translated by Richard Pevear and Larissa Volokhonsky

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David D's avatar

An insightful observation which lends credence to reluctance to publicise the ‘Epstein list’, for fear of exposing true character of political establishment.

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John Turcot's avatar

"The truth will set you free",.... In Heaven, perhaps, but on Earth, it will imprison you.... just ask Julian Assange.

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Spercepolnes's avatar

Absolutely! I and my wife are autistic....'on the spectrum" .... and for most of my life I had virtually no filters. I often got into strife - throughout most stratas of society and finally realised it was because, when asked for an opinion/observation or just a general question - I would always answer with what I considered a truthful reply. Then wondered why people, and authoritarians got upset. Nowadays, I use it to fight back!

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russian_bot's avatar

Maybe it's they who are "on the spectrum"?

“A time is coming when men will go mad, and when they see someone who is not mad, they will attack him, saying, ‘You are mad; you are not like us.'”

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MakeTheWorldSafeForDiversity's avatar

It gets me that it wasn't enough to destroy Gaza's inhabitants, they had to destroy the people trying to enlighten the world to the killing. The destruction of those trying to tell the story is in a way worse because people dying in a genocide can be conforted knowing that their deaths will have meaning knowing that people will try to make sure their genocide is the last. Thank you for telling their martyrdom for truth.

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David Baird's avatar

Leaders of supposed 'democracies' around the globe are as guilty as any of constantly honing their skills in art of obfuscation, distortion, avoidance, half-truths and outright lying. In addition to which they will attack, in any way possible, those who have the temerity to point out their failings, ask awkward questions or accuse them of failing to carry out their hand-on-heart promises. They will use the courts as a threat or conduct raids on individuals and institutions in order to ensure complaisance. The art of the pre-emptive buckle is alive and well in Australia. Here we were promised an anti-corruption watchdog with teeth and have been given a cuddly poodle; the promises of whistle-blower protection laws have evaporated and the 'guilty' remain incarcerated; political donations laws are a farce. The duopoly LibLab rotating governments continue to look after themselves and their declared pursuit of truth and oft talked about 'transparency' are as rock-solid as the faintest mist.

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denise ward's avatar

It's our belief in written laws. Anything on paper is two dimensional and we are multi dimensional so we really have to prune ourselves to go along with "laws". The idea is preposterous and now we are seeing it metastasize as they bring in laws that take every freedom away. If we comply.

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Patrick Powers's avatar

Society is founded on lies.

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Robert H Stiver's avatar

Truth to power, as always, from you, Caitlin. Thank you.

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Patrick Powers's avatar

"Honey, does this skirt make me look fat?"

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Truth Seeking Missile's avatar

Truth can be defined in so many ways to forge chains around individual freedoms. I do however hold honesty to be high moral ground.

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