Since capitalism has evolved since Marx's time, there are more classes than just the 2 (Marx referred to the 'petite bourgeoisie' also, though he did not adequately define them, instead calling them 'smaller capitalists').
The classes:
- bourgeoisie, petite bourgeoisie, proletariat, lumpenproletariat, peasants, and a new "transnational capitalist class".
imo, most other classes are actually mere 'subdivisions' of the 2 actual classes. some (petite bourgeoisie, pmc, the 'middle' class, maybe the 'political' and 'military' classes) are condoned to mitigate the ruling class' problem of the 'numbers' caitlin regularly mentions by creating the illusion that there's 'class mobility' without taking the loyalty oath ('but first you must learn how to smile as you kill') and being complicit in the great game of exploitation of the many by the few.
the subdivisions of the proletariat indeed seem more tied to the historical circumstances of marx' time with the 'proletariat' being the part of the working class that can be made 'conscious', the 'lumpenproletariat' being the part that is so marginalized that they can't be made 'conscious' as all of their energy is absorbed by the struggle for mere survival, and the (feudal) 'peasants' being unable to get 'conscious' because they haven't experienced industrialization and actual capitalism. (maoist thought kinda tried to disprove that one can't skip the industrialization step in the evolution, which was quite a struggle).
but totally agree with the premise that capitalism evolved significantly since marx and that one should 'dialectically' adapt marxism to the circumstances that have arisen since and not disregard the ability of a conscious capitalism to reactionary adapt and counter the analyses and praxis of marxism and socialism. (e.g. i don't think marx and lenin foresaw capitalism's use of fascism to counter and co-opt revolutionary sentiments into a reset to the status quo).
Something I have never found in Marx's writing, what happens when we don't evolve from Capitalism to Socialism. I have a feeling we are living it with this mad dash to nuclear war : (
I don't believe that is what Marx wrote. In fact Marx had said to Lenin, Stalin and Trotsky their project to Communism would fail not having passed through Capitalism if history writes it correctly. Let me know where to find a better source. Not an expert in Marx's writings.
Landru, Sorry if my 'throw away line' confused you. I am not an 'expert' of any kind. It is my observation of the present political scene and neoliberal capitalism. And of course what I have read.
To quote Lenin: " Fascism is capitalism in decay". The decay of which we can observe in the present time - Trumpism in the US, rise of despots in South America and beyond, the increasing influence of neo-fascist parties and far-right movements in Europe - are responses to the crisis of global capitalism.
We can also observe the increasingly authoritarian laws curtailing freedoms being passed in western "democracies". The rise and rise of oligarchs and powerful lobbies.
from a marxist perspective there's only 2, workers and owners.
Since capitalism has evolved since Marx's time, there are more classes than just the 2 (Marx referred to the 'petite bourgeoisie' also, though he did not adequately define them, instead calling them 'smaller capitalists').
The classes:
- bourgeoisie, petite bourgeoisie, proletariat, lumpenproletariat, peasants, and a new "transnational capitalist class".
imo, most other classes are actually mere 'subdivisions' of the 2 actual classes. some (petite bourgeoisie, pmc, the 'middle' class, maybe the 'political' and 'military' classes) are condoned to mitigate the ruling class' problem of the 'numbers' caitlin regularly mentions by creating the illusion that there's 'class mobility' without taking the loyalty oath ('but first you must learn how to smile as you kill') and being complicit in the great game of exploitation of the many by the few.
the subdivisions of the proletariat indeed seem more tied to the historical circumstances of marx' time with the 'proletariat' being the part of the working class that can be made 'conscious', the 'lumpenproletariat' being the part that is so marginalized that they can't be made 'conscious' as all of their energy is absorbed by the struggle for mere survival, and the (feudal) 'peasants' being unable to get 'conscious' because they haven't experienced industrialization and actual capitalism. (maoist thought kinda tried to disprove that one can't skip the industrialization step in the evolution, which was quite a struggle).
but totally agree with the premise that capitalism evolved significantly since marx and that one should 'dialectically' adapt marxism to the circumstances that have arisen since and not disregard the ability of a conscious capitalism to reactionary adapt and counter the analyses and praxis of marxism and socialism. (e.g. i don't think marx and lenin foresaw capitalism's use of fascism to counter and co-opt revolutionary sentiments into a reset to the status quo).
Something I have never found in Marx's writing, what happens when we don't evolve from Capitalism to Socialism. I have a feeling we are living it with this mad dash to nuclear war : (
Landru, You don't evolve from Capitalism to Socialism. The next step from capitalism - specially from the neoliberal kind we now have - is Fascism.
I don't believe that is what Marx wrote. In fact Marx had said to Lenin, Stalin and Trotsky their project to Communism would fail not having passed through Capitalism if history writes it correctly. Let me know where to find a better source. Not an expert in Marx's writings.
Landru, Sorry if my 'throw away line' confused you. I am not an 'expert' of any kind. It is my observation of the present political scene and neoliberal capitalism. And of course what I have read.
To quote Lenin: " Fascism is capitalism in decay". The decay of which we can observe in the present time - Trumpism in the US, rise of despots in South America and beyond, the increasing influence of neo-fascist parties and far-right movements in Europe - are responses to the crisis of global capitalism.
We can also observe the increasingly authoritarian laws curtailing freedoms being passed in western "democracies". The rise and rise of oligarchs and powerful lobbies.