Nope - too many conspiracy theorists on Caitlin's substack (and on Substack in general). This is BLOWBACK - plain and simple - just as 9/11 was blowback and Oct 7 was blowback.
There ya go again, ignoring the evidence that is so clear a child could see it.
9/11 was, in no way, "blow back". It was an Israeli* inspired false flag. Even the MSM was full of stories of how easy it was for the perpetrators to slip through US security..
If that were the only instance, perhaps I'd give you the benefit of the doubt.
But then there are the Tsarnaev brothers of the Boston Marathon bombing.
And how do you know that? Think they don't have to resources to make just about every publicly violent act done by their own hand? Israel cannot be trusted. On Oct 7, with Israels huge surveillance arsenal, they would have known there was going to be an insurgence. They are liars and looters and murderers. I'm talking about the regime not the people. But many of their people love all the killing too.
Well just your saying it doesn't make it so. Israel is psychopathic and sadistic. If it were a person, I'd have nothing to do with them. Why do people suck up to psychopaths? It only makes them bolder.
"Not everything is a SCAD or false flag"? True, but Tom? So many things are. So what "he" wrote a manifesto. Those things are easy enough for forge. So what he shouted "Free Palestine". Have you read or watched "The Manchurian Candidate"? In the past 10 years alone since my home was stolen from me (foolishly purchased on native land) I have experienced corruption and criminality – and manipulation – on the part of all our "leaders", that even though it happened to me? I'm still stunned with incredulity!
>>"9/11 was, in no way, "blow back". It was an Israeli* inspired false flag."
HaHa - did you not read my comment elsewhere on this article that "Substack is FULL of conspiracy theorists and unfortunately so is Caitlin's substack"?
I'm not going to argue conspiracy theories with Conspiracy Theorists - there is a psychology behind it. Conspiracy theorists NEED to believe in such theories to help them make sense of a senseless world. This NEED to believe in such theories is so strong that it becomes a part of their core - regardless of the evidence, facts, whatever.
You are welcome to waste your life chasing down conspiracy theories - they seem to help you make sense of the world and keep you sane - so go for it - stay emotionally healthy - use whatever coping mechanism works. I prefer reality (no matter how uncomfortable it may be for me). The world doesn't need to 'have to' make sense to me - I am ok with the randomness, the chaosness, and all the coincidences in the world - everything doesn't need to have a reason or an explanation - everything doesn't need to have a solution or an answer. I'm comfortable with unknowns and uncertainty.
Most conspiracy theorists are uncomfortable with randomness, lack of causality, lack of coherence, lack of patterns, and lack of definite answers and explanations that are all too common in a universe with more questions than answers.
Believing in conspiracy theories has NOTHING (or very little) to do with one's intelligence. But you would know that if you were well versed on the subject.
Dude, believe whatever makes you comfortable. Why does it matter to you what I believe or what I think?
Right, you are "well-versed" you have a degree in "conspiracy theories".
Use that condescending tone again and I will damn you to eternity. You aren't necessarily the brightest bulb in the room.
You're telling us (although subtly) to "Shut up and go away".
Well, I AIN'T GOIN' AWAY.
I don't care what you think or believe, but I do care that you've sold your soul to promote chaos and confusion about a subject that is clear as day.
You are indirectly excusing and providing cover for the slaughter of the Palestinians by insisting that only a (probably deranged) "lone wolf" would ever take action against genocide.
No one here wants to have that label attached to them.
You are an excellent propagandist. You know how to subtly suggest that "Black is really white" and "War is really Peace."
"There is no expedient to which a man will not resort to avoid the labor of thinking."
– Joshua Reynolds
"Most people would sooner die than think. In fact, they do."
– Betrand Russell
The issue Chang, is not my belief (amply demonstrated) that the very rich and powerful are actively working to maintain their position to the rest of humanity's detriment. The issue is your automatic flat rejection – in totality – of the thesis.
The way I have expressed myself (i.e. my automatic flat rejection) is not automatic (though it seems that way). I don't intend to bore people here (or elsewhere) with the nitty-gritty details that goes into thinking before I arrive at conclusions.
Hence, people don't get to see all the steps (and effort) that my mind makes in critically thinking about the situation - they only see the end result - which is the conclusion. Hence the impression that my response is "automatic".
Critical thinking is NEVER automatic - it is deliberative, cognitively demanding, and energy draining (for the specifics of this I refer you to Daniel Kahneman's book - Thinking Fast and Slow). But people only ever get to observe the end results (i.e. the conclusions) of the though process - hence the appearance of "automatic or haphazard or incomplete" thinking.
If I were to explain all the details of WHY the probabilites are exceedingly low (low enough to discard the false-flag hypothesis) for this event to be a 'FALSE FLAG' event, it would take several pages - and NO ONE is interested in that (or has the patience or time for it). No one here is interested in reading detailed, researched, analysis - of this or anything else. That is ONE of the problems/limitations of online discussion arenas/spaces - it doesn't give one the depth needed to really examine discourses in adequate detail.
"Rich and powerful people don't get together and make plans! You're a kook! You're a 'Conspiracy Buff'"
– George Carlin
Sorry Chang, but for me, especially 9/11? Anyone who uses the term "Conspiracy Theory" in any context, for me is immediately suspect. "Conspiracy Theory" was a notion created by the CIA in the wake of the Warren Commission's grotesque conclusions regarding the first Kennedy Assassination. I'm aware of Cass Sunstein's 2008 paper on "Conspiracy Theory"; I was unable to read it, it was so biased and contemptuous of the mere possibility. You might do well to read "Conspiracy Theory in America by Lance deHaven-Smith" and the more recent "180 Degrees: Unlearn the Lies You've Been Taught to Believe" by Feargus O'Connor Greenwood. The creatures running our shared shitshow treat "reality" like a game of chess, they're always planning 4-5 moves ahead. The one thing in our favor? They're not actually all that clever... 🤔🙄
There are also different TYPES of conspiracy theories. Here is an interesting look at some of the different types/categories -> [https://conspiracychart.com]
In retrospect the silence in this morning's news could indicate that they (Israel) are now scared. False flag or not it will probably mark the beginning of a string of attacks on Israeli institutions. As ye sow so shall ye reap. I suspect that the US could be next for these attacks.
This happened right after a few European and British politicians turned on them. Its always the sympathy play with them, they get none from me. Any Zionist or their servants are fair game in my book, and that includes this "happy" fucking couple.
Now you have totally lost me. You use "conspiracy theorists" and "conspiracy theory" exactly how the CIA initially intended its use when the term was coined after JFK. I even suspect you now as some sort of controlled opposition after previously agreeing with many of your comments.
To summarize: No, this murder was not part of a Mossad conspiracy or false flag, but 9/11 almost assuredly was. What do you know about the Munich Olympics, BTW? Do you think "Black September" was a Palestinian operation? If so, I can recommend some reading materials.
I don't mean to use Conspircy Theorists in a pejorative way. Conspiracy Theorists are usually quite intelligent people - they take great effort at seeking out patterns and attempting to connect-the-dots.
Also, there are several conspiracy theories that ARE true.
>>" I even suspect you now as some sort of controlled opposition after previously agreeing with many of your comments."
That is more conspiratorial thinking on your part.
Like I to said to someone else, I'm not going to argue individual conspiracy theoies with you. It is ALWAYS a time-waster and counter-productive.
I could recommend many books for you to read (on conspiracy theories and conspiratorial thinking and WHY people believe conspiracies), but I am quite confident that you will not read them. If you decide to change your mind, let me know.
If you equate ANYTHING I've said with support of Israelis or Zionists or the such, then you've got BIGGER critical thinking problems and logic issues to deal with than conspiracy theories.
Why does it matter to you so much what I think about Conspiracy Theories and Conspiracy Theorists and conspiracism? I'm not stopping you from believing in them.
(2) The Believing Brain: From Ghosts and Gods to Politics and Conspiracies---How We Construct Beliefs and Reinforce Them as Truths (https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/11438651)
He is a glowie for sure. These fucking ops and AI, its time to go low tech and begin the conversations in non digital places, that way when we spot the op, we can block their comments the old fashioned way.
" did you not read my comment elsewhere on this article that "Substack is FULL of conspiracy theorists and unfortunately so is Caitlin's substack"? - HA HA !
No 9/11 was not done by Muslims. Oh boy. Do you even know that Building 7 went down the same way on that day? Do you know it was reported by the BBC 20 minutes before it went down? Oh there is so much more.
Why should I? You're not going to believe me whatever I say. This is the basis of conspiratorial thinking - no amount of evidence or facts or truth dissuades a conspiracy theorist from abandoning their theories. On rare occasions, some intellectually honest people DO manage to change their minds.
Conspiracy theorists weave and weave and weave - their egos are too tightly tied to their theories unfortunately, thus making the 'denying of their conspiracy theories' a personal matter.
I agree Chang. There is no reason to believe this wasn’t just a frustrated, angry citizen, much like Mangione. This is to be expected. It is going to increase as the oppression increases. The Zionist genocide has been taken advantage of by many governments (most notably the USA and UK) to introduce authoritarian, pre-Nazi oppressions. Just as in Europe in the 1940s, internal citizens and groups will form a resistance. Israel is certainly capable of a false flag event like this but my guess is that Mangione and Rodriguez are early examples of what is to come. As the resistance matures you’ll see more attacks on the politicians and oligarchs.
For those who worry these individual acts will give the "fascists the ammo they need to come after us", the fascists don't need "ammo". Coming after those they label as "other" and those who are like them but disagree with them is in the fascist DNA. Biden, Trump, Sunak, and Starmer didn't need events like this to introduce legislation and tactics to suppress peaceful protests. They are coming for us; we should be getting ready rather than condemning individual acts or debating conspiracy theories.
>>"Coming after those they label as "other" and those who are like them but disagree with them is in the fascist DNA. Biden, Trump, Sunak, and Starmer didn't need events like this to introduce legislation and tactics to suppress peaceful protests."
I disapprove of your use of the pejorative "conspiracy theorists" because it is a CIA coined phrase designed specifically to de-legitimize critical discussion of SCADs (state crimes against democracy).
That said, I 100% agree with you that this was not a false flag. There is too much evidence otherwise and people are not savvy enough to parse the information from the noise and bullshit.
Conspiracy theories thrive in societies in upheaval, with poor education systems, disaffected populations, and low social capital. But experts can’t simply tell people to stop believing lies. Rather, society has to put people in a better position to see the truth. This is part of what Caitlin does with her Substack articles.
And remember - conspiracy theories are NOT unique to the U.S. They are global.
Tom, you're not interested in the truth to the same level as you are interested in believing the theories you wish to believe. There is NO END to the excuses, twists, deflections, connections, irrelevant information, etc. that a conspiracy theorist would go through to defend their beliefs. Your comments are PROOF of that.
You are like Caitlin's Harry Sisson. You don't care about the meat of any argument. You want to be "right" and be "liked" - So if you don't want to lose me completely, please attempt to actually answer my original inquiry about the term "conspiracy theory" and when it first gained prominence and wide usage - in your own words. Not links.
Again, keeping in mind that I am here to SHOOT DOWN the notion that the killings of the Israeli consulate/embassy employees was some kind of "false flag" or conspiracy!
You need to get over this notion of "winning" or "correcting 'wrong' people on the Internet" and truly engage in dialog.
Ok - now you are crossing over onto ad hominem attacks. I don't care what you think - as you are unable to engage in the conversation in good faith and in an intellectually honest way.
Believe whatever you want - I really don't care. I'm also not interested in engaging in a conversation with you - go all out and believe in whatever you want - conspiracy theories or not.
The dispatch was produced in response to a Freedom of Information Act request by the New York Times in 1976.
The dispatch states:
2. This trend of opinion is a matter of concern to the U.S. government, including our organization.
The aim of this dispatch is to provide materialcountering and discrediting the claims of the conspiracy theorists, so as to inhibit the circulation of such claims in other countries. Background information is supplied in a classified section and in a number of unclassified attachments.
3. Action. We do not recommend that discussion of the [conspiracy] question be initiated where it is not already taking place. Where discussion is active addresses are requested:
a. To discuss the publicity problem with and friendly elite contacts (especially politicians and editors) , pointing out that the [official investigation of the relevant event] made as thorough an investigation as humanly possible, that the charges of the critics are without serious foundation, and that further speculative discussion only plays into the hands of the opposition. Point out also that parts of the conspiracy talk appear to be deliberately generated by … propagandists. Urge them to use their influence to discourage unfounded and irresponsible speculation.
b. To employ propaganda assets to and refute the attacks of the critics. Book reviews and feature articles are particularly appropriate for this purpose. The unclassified attachments to this guidance should provide useful background material for passing to assets. Our ploy should point out, as applicable, that the critics are (I) wedded to theories adopted before the evidence was in, (II) politically interested, (III) financially interested, (IV) hasty and inaccurate in their research, or (V) infatuated with their own theories.
4. In private to media discussions not directed at any particular writer, or in attacking publications which may be yet forthcoming, the following arguments should be useful:
a. No significant new evidence has emerged which the Commission did not consider.
b. Critics usually overvalue particular items and ignore others. They tend to place more emphasis on the recollections of individual witnesses (which are less reliable and more divergent–and hence offer more hand-holds for criticism) …
c. Conspiracy on the large scale often suggested would be impossible to conceal in the United States, esp. since informants could expect to receive large royalties, etc.
d. Critics have often been enticed by a form of intellectual pride: they light on some theory and fall in love with it; they also scoff at the Commission because it did not always answer every question with a flat decision one way or the other.
f. As to charges that the Commission’s report was a rush job, it emerged three months after the deadline originally set. But to the degree that the Commission tried to speed up its reporting, this was largely due to the pressure of irresponsible speculation already appearing, in some cases coming from the same critics who, refusing to admit their errors, are now putting out new criticisms.
g. Such vague accusations as that “more than ten people have died mysteriously” can always be explained in some natural way
5. Where possible, counter speculation by encouraging reference to the Commission’s Report itself. Open-minded foreign readers should still be impressed by the care, thoroughness, objectivity and speed with which the Commission worked. Reviewers of other books might be encouraged to add to their account the idea that, checking back with the report itself, they found it far superior to the work of its critics.
That is the First sign of weak critical thinking - to look at sources first instead of critically parsing the information. Sources should be looked at for bias, but the information withing should be analyzed and though about critically FIRST.
Otherwise, what you are simply doing is displaying CONFIRMATION BIAS. You can simply deny any sources that go against your confirmation biases (as you are doing with Snopes currently). The left does this, the right does this, liberals do this, conservatives to this.
Are you ready to challenge your confirmation baises? And think critically? Are you open to reading (at at intellectual and academic level) about Conspiracism?
You seem to be threatened by facts/evidence that go against your beliefs - as evidenced by your long-winded 'detailed' comment (and attempt) at trying to find flaws in the above mentioned sources. That is the normal behavior/response of someone when they are faced with facts that question their deeply held beliefs. Congratulations - you are normal.
Care to tell us what you think about 9/11? I'd be interested and it would inform my future 'consumption' of your output on this site. Like go at it; free-form. What **are** your thoughts about the events prior to, on, and shortly after that day? Don't hold back.
OK, enough of this time-wasting shit. Why are you trying to hard to convince me of your beliefs and conspiracies? I really don't care what you believe. Go bonkers and believe whatever you want.
You literally did the exact same thing in your very first reply. LOL
Have you literally/critically parsed the information uncovered as part of a FOIA request on the nature of the term "conspiracy theory"?
Just posting links to Snopes, AP, or fucking Breitbart and Fox (for all I care) proves you're just being lazy. And that you can't take the time to elucidate and articulate your own points in your own words.
And let's stick to the topic: "conspiracy theory" - the etymology or origins. The original prevalence of the term coincides exactly with the CIA's internal memo and their infiltration of numerous "legacy" media/news outlets - and - those outlets beginning to use the term regularly.
Think again about your "argument" here - like actually take a moment to think and not just hammer out a reply.
Dude, you're tiresome - why is your ego so tightly intertwined with your beliefs in your theories? So what if you're wrong? Is it the end of the world for you? You're behaving like a flat-earther now.
OK - I'm done with this discussion - you are free to spend your time however you wish, chasing down whatever theories you need to and believing whatever keeps you emotionally sane.
False flag or not, I see this setting the pro Palestinian movement back and give Trump, Rubio & the other cabinet fascists the ammo they need to come after "us" . . . .
That's one way of looking at it. Another way of looking at it is as an expansion of awareness of what the world has come to.
Things CANNOT go back to how they were before this Genocide. The world has FOREVER changed. Much about the future is going to be unpredictable and uncomfortable.
All I know is that the Genocidal state of Israel MUST BE DESTROYED (in one way or another), and MUST CEASE TO EXIST in its current form...
This is blowback from humans that are appalled by the Genocide conducted by Israel. There is MUCH MORE blowback (of similar kinds AND worse) yet to come for Israel.
Similarly, there is MUCH BLOWBACK yet to be received by the U.S. Empire for its decades it imperialist policies.
It is only a matter of time before ORDINARY HUMANS (and the Global South) do with comes naturally to humans - revenge and retaliation - for all the oppression, exploitation, imperialism, terrorism, etc. suffered by ordinary people (and the Global South) at the hands of the U.S. Empire and Israel.
Like I said, these are the consequences of BLOWBACK.
Nope - too many conspiracy theorists on Caitlin's substack (and on Substack in general). This is BLOWBACK - plain and simple - just as 9/11 was blowback and Oct 7 was blowback.
There ya go again, ignoring the evidence that is so clear a child could see it.
9/11 was, in no way, "blow back". It was an Israeli* inspired false flag. Even the MSM was full of stories of how easy it was for the perpetrators to slip through US security..
If that were the only instance, perhaps I'd give you the benefit of the doubt.
But then there are the Tsarnaev brothers of the Boston Marathon bombing.
And JFK and RFK assassinations.
It isn't some "guy-off-the-street" that does this
Dude. The perp wrote an incredible 'manifesto' and shouted Free Palestine, Free Free Palestine when arrested. C'mon - Emerge from the rabbit hole.
https://www.nefariousrussians.com/p/cycles-of-violence
https://www.kenklippenstein.com/p/the-israel-embassy-shooter-manifesto
Not everything is a SCAD or false flag.
And how do you know that? Think they don't have to resources to make just about every publicly violent act done by their own hand? Israel cannot be trusted. On Oct 7, with Israels huge surveillance arsenal, they would have known there was going to be an insurgence. They are liars and looters and murderers. I'm talking about the regime not the people. But many of their people love all the killing too.
You're correct Denise. xoxo
Israel did not fucking do this, denise. Wake the fuck up.
Well just your saying it doesn't make it so. Israel is psychopathic and sadistic. If it were a person, I'd have nothing to do with them. Why do people suck up to psychopaths? It only makes them bolder.
easy with the modifiers there, cowboy
"Not everything is a SCAD or false flag"? True, but Tom? So many things are. So what "he" wrote a manifesto. Those things are easy enough for forge. So what he shouted "Free Palestine". Have you read or watched "The Manchurian Candidate"? In the past 10 years alone since my home was stolen from me (foolishly purchased on native land) I have experienced corruption and criminality – and manipulation – on the part of all our "leaders", that even though it happened to me? I'm still stunned with incredulity!
>>"9/11 was, in no way, "blow back". It was an Israeli* inspired false flag."
HaHa - did you not read my comment elsewhere on this article that "Substack is FULL of conspiracy theorists and unfortunately so is Caitlin's substack"?
I'm not going to argue conspiracy theories with Conspiracy Theorists - there is a psychology behind it. Conspiracy theorists NEED to believe in such theories to help them make sense of a senseless world. This NEED to believe in such theories is so strong that it becomes a part of their core - regardless of the evidence, facts, whatever.
You are welcome to waste your life chasing down conspiracy theories - they seem to help you make sense of the world and keep you sane - so go for it - stay emotionally healthy - use whatever coping mechanism works. I prefer reality (no matter how uncomfortable it may be for me). The world doesn't need to 'have to' make sense to me - I am ok with the randomness, the chaosness, and all the coincidences in the world - everything doesn't need to have a reason or an explanation - everything doesn't need to have a solution or an answer. I'm comfortable with unknowns and uncertainty.
Most conspiracy theorists are uncomfortable with randomness, lack of causality, lack of coherence, lack of patterns, and lack of definite answers and explanations that are all too common in a universe with more questions than answers.
Go ahead, play The Walter Cronkite role in promoting the conclusions of the Warren commission.
Interject your snob appeal about how stupid I am because I need to make sense of "a senseless world".
Fuk-an-A I want it to make sense and I have to question why you don't.
Talk about false-flags, here you are right in front of us providing us with excuses to turn away from the obvious that is right before us.
>>"Interject your snob appeal about how stupid"
Believing in conspiracy theories has NOTHING (or very little) to do with one's intelligence. But you would know that if you were well versed on the subject.
Dude, believe whatever makes you comfortable. Why does it matter to you what I believe or what I think?
Right, you are "well-versed" you have a degree in "conspiracy theories".
Use that condescending tone again and I will damn you to eternity. You aren't necessarily the brightest bulb in the room.
You're telling us (although subtly) to "Shut up and go away".
Well, I AIN'T GOIN' AWAY.
I don't care what you think or believe, but I do care that you've sold your soul to promote chaos and confusion about a subject that is clear as day.
You are indirectly excusing and providing cover for the slaughter of the Palestinians by insisting that only a (probably deranged) "lone wolf" would ever take action against genocide.
No one here wants to have that label attached to them.
You are an excellent propagandist. You know how to subtly suggest that "Black is really white" and "War is really Peace."
Go back to the advertising agency you came from.
Sheesh - now you are being stupid with your comment here...
Believe whatever you want, believe whatever makes you happy. Believe you have all the answers.
Here you are again, with your megaphone
"There is no expedient to which a man will not resort to avoid the labor of thinking."
– Joshua Reynolds
"Most people would sooner die than think. In fact, they do."
– Betrand Russell
The issue Chang, is not my belief (amply demonstrated) that the very rich and powerful are actively working to maintain their position to the rest of humanity's detriment. The issue is your automatic flat rejection – in totality – of the thesis.
I give up.
>>"The issue is your automatic flat rejection"
The way I have expressed myself (i.e. my automatic flat rejection) is not automatic (though it seems that way). I don't intend to bore people here (or elsewhere) with the nitty-gritty details that goes into thinking before I arrive at conclusions.
Hence, people don't get to see all the steps (and effort) that my mind makes in critically thinking about the situation - they only see the end result - which is the conclusion. Hence the impression that my response is "automatic".
Critical thinking is NEVER automatic - it is deliberative, cognitively demanding, and energy draining (for the specifics of this I refer you to Daniel Kahneman's book - Thinking Fast and Slow). But people only ever get to observe the end results (i.e. the conclusions) of the though process - hence the appearance of "automatic or haphazard or incomplete" thinking.
If I were to explain all the details of WHY the probabilites are exceedingly low (low enough to discard the false-flag hypothesis) for this event to be a 'FALSE FLAG' event, it would take several pages - and NO ONE is interested in that (or has the patience or time for it). No one here is interested in reading detailed, researched, analysis - of this or anything else. That is ONE of the problems/limitations of online discussion arenas/spaces - it doesn't give one the depth needed to really examine discourses in adequate detail.
That's all well and good and I'm glad your critical faculties are functioning. Just remember with any and all factoids:
1. Who is telling you this? and
2. Why are they telling you?
The old Roman adage applies: "Cui bono?"
You're assuming that my critical thinking is that shallow that I have not considered these (and many other) points?
Oh you don't think conspiracies happen? You're giving us a profile of yourself.
"Rich and powerful people don't get together and make plans! You're a kook! You're a 'Conspiracy Buff'"
– George Carlin
Sorry Chang, but for me, especially 9/11? Anyone who uses the term "Conspiracy Theory" in any context, for me is immediately suspect. "Conspiracy Theory" was a notion created by the CIA in the wake of the Warren Commission's grotesque conclusions regarding the first Kennedy Assassination. I'm aware of Cass Sunstein's 2008 paper on "Conspiracy Theory"; I was unable to read it, it was so biased and contemptuous of the mere possibility. You might do well to read "Conspiracy Theory in America by Lance deHaven-Smith" and the more recent "180 Degrees: Unlearn the Lies You've Been Taught to Believe" by Feargus O'Connor Greenwood. The creatures running our shared shitshow treat "reality" like a game of chess, they're always planning 4-5 moves ahead. The one thing in our favor? They're not actually all that clever... 🤔🙄
Oh boy! Another conspiracy theorist? Why am I not surprised?
The CIA coining "conspiracy theory" has alread been discussed (and debunked) here -> https://www.caitlinjohnst.one/p/thoughts-on-the-israeli-embassy-staff/comment/119448193
If you're serious (at an intellectual level) about understanding conspiracy theories, conspiracy culture, conspiracy psychology, and more - then I suggest you take at a list of some of the books I mentioned here ->https://www.caitlinjohnst.one/p/thoughts-on-the-israeli-embassy-staff/comment/119460442
BTW, it takes knowledge, critical thinking skills, and effort to DISTINGUISH the FALSE conspiracies from the TRUE conspiracies (yes, there are a few that are true ->https://www.caitlinjohnst.one/p/thoughts-on-the-israeli-embassy-staff/comment/119460442).
There are also different TYPES of conspiracy theories. Here is an interesting look at some of the different types/categories -> [https://conspiracychart.com]
In retrospect the silence in this morning's news could indicate that they (Israel) are now scared. False flag or not it will probably mark the beginning of a string of attacks on Israeli institutions. As ye sow so shall ye reap. I suspect that the US could be next for these attacks.
This happened right after a few European and British politicians turned on them. Its always the sympathy play with them, they get none from me. Any Zionist or their servants are fair game in my book, and that includes this "happy" fucking couple.
Now you have totally lost me. You use "conspiracy theorists" and "conspiracy theory" exactly how the CIA initially intended its use when the term was coined after JFK. I even suspect you now as some sort of controlled opposition after previously agreeing with many of your comments.
To summarize: No, this murder was not part of a Mossad conspiracy or false flag, but 9/11 almost assuredly was. What do you know about the Munich Olympics, BTW? Do you think "Black September" was a Palestinian operation? If so, I can recommend some reading materials.
I don't mean to use Conspircy Theorists in a pejorative way. Conspiracy Theorists are usually quite intelligent people - they take great effort at seeking out patterns and attempting to connect-the-dots.
Also, there are several conspiracy theories that ARE true.
>>" I even suspect you now as some sort of controlled opposition after previously agreeing with many of your comments."
That is more conspiratorial thinking on your part.
Like I to said to someone else, I'm not going to argue individual conspiracy theoies with you. It is ALWAYS a time-waster and counter-productive.
I could recommend many books for you to read (on conspiracy theories and conspiratorial thinking and WHY people believe conspiracies), but I am quite confident that you will not read them. If you decide to change your mind, let me know.
My you are "slick"
Taking your own words and coating them with milk chocolate so we will eat the medicine you've prescribed.
Name a couple of those "Many Books" so we can rip into the banal falsity they are selling.
Stop making excuses for Israeli genocide.
Exactly. His "arguments" slither back and forth to try and get each person to agree with him in some way per reply thread. He a glowie.
If you equate ANYTHING I've said with support of Israelis or Zionists or the such, then you've got BIGGER critical thinking problems and logic issues to deal with than conspiracy theories.
Why does it matter to you so much what I think about Conspiracy Theories and Conspiracy Theorists and conspiracism? I'm not stopping you from believing in them.
Here is a list of 30 books to get you started. It should keep you busy for quite a while...
(1) Conspiracies of Conspiracies: How Delusions Have Overrun America (https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/41591178)
(2) The Believing Brain: From Ghosts and Gods to Politics and Conspiracies---How We Construct Beliefs and Reinforce Them as Truths (https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/11438651)
(3) Conspiracies and Conspiracy Theories in the Age of Trump (https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/40765231)
(4) Conspiracy Theories and the People Who Believe Them (https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/40404817)
(5) Conspiracy Theories: A Primer (https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/121967479)
(6) Conspiracy: A History of Boll*cks Theories, and How Not to Fall for Them (https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/61404604)
(7) Conspiracy: Why the Rational Believe the Irrational (https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/61857147)
(8) Conspirituality: How New Age Conspiracy Theories Became a Health Threat (https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/62874269)
(9) Counter-Knowledge: How We Surrendered to Conspiracy Theories, Quack Medicine, Bogus Science and Fake History (https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/3721140)
(10) Debunked: Separate the Rational from the Irrational in Influential Conspiracy Theories (https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/60019327)
(11) Debunking 9/11 Myths: Why Conspiracy Theories Can't Stand Up to the Facts (https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/12321929)
(12) Debunking Conspiracy Theories (https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/41545720)
(13) Denying Science: Conspiracy Theories, Media Distortions, and the War Against Reality (https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/12410995)
(14) Empire of Conspiracy: The Culture of Paranoia in Postwar America (https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/536292)
(15) Enemies Within: The Culture of Conspiracy in Modern America (https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/313837)
(16) Escaping the Rabbit Hole: How to Debunk Conspiracy Theories Using Facts, Logic, and Respect (https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/69776129)
(17) Hope and Fear: Modern Myths, Conspiracy Theories and Pseudo History (https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/59095232)
(18) Impossible Knowledge: Conspiracy Theories, Power, and Truth (https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/42524472-impossible-knowledge)
(19) Off the Edge: Flat Earthers, Conspiracy Culture, and Why People Will Believe Anything (https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/56437694)
(20) Suspicious Minds: Why We Believe Conspiracy Theories (https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/23848322)
(21) The Anatomy of Deception: Conspiracy Theories, Distrust, and Public Health in America (https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/197812276)
(22) The Demon-Haunted World: Science as a Candle in the Dark (https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/995796)
(23) The Nature of Conspiracy Theories (https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/53236264)
(24) The Psychology of Conspiracy Theories (https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/38366098)
(25) The Social Psychology of Gullibility: Conspiracy Theories, Fake News and Irrational Beliefs (https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/43151730)
(26) The United States of Paranoia: A Conspiracy Theory (https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/17331306)
(27) They Knew: How a Culture of Conspiracy Keeps America Complacent (https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/59808707)
(28) Voodoo Histories: The Role of the Conspiracy Theory in Shaping Modern History (https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/7668651)
(29) Weaponizing Conspiracy Theories (https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/208489516)
(30) Awful Archives: Conspiracy Theory, Rhetoric, and Acts of Evidence (https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/52371630)
Okay, now I know you're a recruit in a boiler room in Bethesda. Yap yap yap....NSA
He is a glowie for sure. These fucking ops and AI, its time to go low tech and begin the conversations in non digital places, that way when we spot the op, we can block their comments the old fashioned way.
" did you not read my comment elsewhere on this article that "Substack is FULL of conspiracy theorists and unfortunately so is Caitlin's substack"? - HA HA !
https://vtforeignpolicy.com/2025/04/zionist-israel-still-suppresses-trump-release-of-jfk-9-11-and-jeffrey-epstein-files/
So you get DISTRACTED that easily by such narratives that appeal to your confirmation biases?
And you LIKE your OWN comments too? That is NOT a good look.
idk, maybe this is going a bit out of focus? (no offense).
Of course it's going out of focus - it always does - anytime 'conspiracy theorists' crawl out of the woodwork (which is often on Caitlin's substack).
Cute conspiracy theory.
Here you come again, tonsils flapping
No 9/11 was not done by Muslims. Oh boy. Do you even know that Building 7 went down the same way on that day? Do you know it was reported by the BBC 20 minutes before it went down? Oh there is so much more.
No offense, Denise, but I usually ignore ALL your comments - different wavelengths. I apologize.
No I can tell you're closed minded. Like I said earlier, you're giving a profile of yourself for all to see.
Whatever you say Denise.
Explain to us what happened to WTC-7.
This should be good.
Why should I? You're not going to believe me whatever I say. This is the basis of conspiratorial thinking - no amount of evidence or facts or truth dissuades a conspiracy theorist from abandoning their theories. On rare occasions, some intellectually honest people DO manage to change their minds.
Conspiracy theorists weave and weave and weave - their egos are too tightly tied to their theories unfortunately, thus making the 'denying of their conspiracy theories' a personal matter.
I agree Chang. There is no reason to believe this wasn’t just a frustrated, angry citizen, much like Mangione. This is to be expected. It is going to increase as the oppression increases. The Zionist genocide has been taken advantage of by many governments (most notably the USA and UK) to introduce authoritarian, pre-Nazi oppressions. Just as in Europe in the 1940s, internal citizens and groups will form a resistance. Israel is certainly capable of a false flag event like this but my guess is that Mangione and Rodriguez are early examples of what is to come. As the resistance matures you’ll see more attacks on the politicians and oligarchs.
For those who worry these individual acts will give the "fascists the ammo they need to come after us", the fascists don't need "ammo". Coming after those they label as "other" and those who are like them but disagree with them is in the fascist DNA. Biden, Trump, Sunak, and Starmer didn't need events like this to introduce legislation and tactics to suppress peaceful protests. They are coming for us; we should be getting ready rather than condemning individual acts or debating conspiracy theories.
>>"Coming after those they label as "other" and those who are like them but disagree with them is in the fascist DNA. Biden, Trump, Sunak, and Starmer didn't need events like this to introduce legislation and tactics to suppress peaceful protests."
EXACTLY! 💯
I disapprove of your use of the pejorative "conspiracy theorists" because it is a CIA coined phrase designed specifically to de-legitimize critical discussion of SCADs (state crimes against democracy).
That said, I 100% agree with you that this was not a false flag. There is too much evidence otherwise and people are not savvy enough to parse the information from the noise and bullshit.
>>" because it is a CIA coined phrase"
Tom, please get your facts straight. The term Conspiracy Theorist and conspiracy theory have been around long before the creation of the CIA.
(1) ‘Conspiracy theory’ coined long before JFK assassination [https://apnews.com/article/fact-check-conspiracy-theory-jfk-941578119864]
(2) https://www.snopes.com/news/2020/03/16/did-the-cia-invent-the-term-conspiracy-theory/
(3) https://theconversation.com/theres-a-conspiracy-theory-that-the-cia-invented-the-term-conspiracy-theory-heres-why-132117 (same content as the previous link)
(4) Conspiracy Theory: The Nineteenth-Century Prehistory of a Twentieth-Century Concept [https://academic.oup.com/book/25369/chapter-abstract/192453115] from the book: "Conspiracy Theories & the People Who Believe Them"
(5) A critical conceptualization of conspiracy theory [https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1111/1467-8675.12683] ->an interesting article around thinking about conspiracies and what exactly is a conspiracy theory.
Conspiracy theories thrive in societies in upheaval, with poor education systems, disaffected populations, and low social capital. But experts can’t simply tell people to stop believing lies. Rather, society has to put people in a better position to see the truth. This is part of what Caitlin does with her Substack articles.
And remember - conspiracy theories are NOT unique to the U.S. They are global.
You're quoting Snopes? LOL!
Jeez, you're trolling me now?
https://www.coreysdigs.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/04/CIA_ConspiracyTheory1.png
Dude - irrelevant.
Do you understand things like "Google analytics" or previous means of determining the frequency of the use of certain terms and phrases?
If so find me a dozen uses of the term "conspiracy theory" in ANY year, combined, prior to 1964.
I'll wait.
Tom, you're not interested in the truth to the same level as you are interested in believing the theories you wish to believe. There is NO END to the excuses, twists, deflections, connections, irrelevant information, etc. that a conspiracy theorist would go through to defend their beliefs. Your comments are PROOF of that.
You are like Caitlin's Harry Sisson. You don't care about the meat of any argument. You want to be "right" and be "liked" - So if you don't want to lose me completely, please attempt to actually answer my original inquiry about the term "conspiracy theory" and when it first gained prominence and wide usage - in your own words. Not links.
Again, keeping in mind that I am here to SHOOT DOWN the notion that the killings of the Israeli consulate/embassy employees was some kind of "false flag" or conspiracy!
You need to get over this notion of "winning" or "correcting 'wrong' people on the Internet" and truly engage in dialog.
Ok - now you are crossing over onto ad hominem attacks. I don't care what you think - as you are unable to engage in the conversation in good faith and in an intellectually honest way.
Believe whatever you want - I really don't care. I'm also not interested in engaging in a conversation with you - go all out and believe in whatever you want - conspiracy theories or not.
LOL. AP? Snopes?
The dispatch was produced in response to a Freedom of Information Act request by the New York Times in 1976.
The dispatch states:
2. This trend of opinion is a matter of concern to the U.S. government, including our organization.
The aim of this dispatch is to provide materialcountering and discrediting the claims of the conspiracy theorists, so as to inhibit the circulation of such claims in other countries. Background information is supplied in a classified section and in a number of unclassified attachments.
3. Action. We do not recommend that discussion of the [conspiracy] question be initiated where it is not already taking place. Where discussion is active addresses are requested:
a. To discuss the publicity problem with and friendly elite contacts (especially politicians and editors) , pointing out that the [official investigation of the relevant event] made as thorough an investigation as humanly possible, that the charges of the critics are without serious foundation, and that further speculative discussion only plays into the hands of the opposition. Point out also that parts of the conspiracy talk appear to be deliberately generated by … propagandists. Urge them to use their influence to discourage unfounded and irresponsible speculation.
b. To employ propaganda assets to and refute the attacks of the critics. Book reviews and feature articles are particularly appropriate for this purpose. The unclassified attachments to this guidance should provide useful background material for passing to assets. Our ploy should point out, as applicable, that the critics are (I) wedded to theories adopted before the evidence was in, (II) politically interested, (III) financially interested, (IV) hasty and inaccurate in their research, or (V) infatuated with their own theories.
4. In private to media discussions not directed at any particular writer, or in attacking publications which may be yet forthcoming, the following arguments should be useful:
a. No significant new evidence has emerged which the Commission did not consider.
b. Critics usually overvalue particular items and ignore others. They tend to place more emphasis on the recollections of individual witnesses (which are less reliable and more divergent–and hence offer more hand-holds for criticism) …
c. Conspiracy on the large scale often suggested would be impossible to conceal in the United States, esp. since informants could expect to receive large royalties, etc.
d. Critics have often been enticed by a form of intellectual pride: they light on some theory and fall in love with it; they also scoff at the Commission because it did not always answer every question with a flat decision one way or the other.
f. As to charges that the Commission’s report was a rush job, it emerged three months after the deadline originally set. But to the degree that the Commission tried to speed up its reporting, this was largely due to the pressure of irresponsible speculation already appearing, in some cases coming from the same critics who, refusing to admit their errors, are now putting out new criticisms.
g. Such vague accusations as that “more than ten people have died mysteriously” can always be explained in some natural way
5. Where possible, counter speculation by encouraging reference to the Commission’s Report itself. Open-minded foreign readers should still be impressed by the care, thoroughness, objectivity and speed with which the Commission worked. Reviewers of other books might be encouraged to add to their account the idea that, checking back with the report itself, they found it far superior to the work of its critics.
>>"LOL. AP? Snopes?"
That is the First sign of weak critical thinking - to look at sources first instead of critically parsing the information. Sources should be looked at for bias, but the information withing should be analyzed and though about critically FIRST.
Otherwise, what you are simply doing is displaying CONFIRMATION BIAS. You can simply deny any sources that go against your confirmation biases (as you are doing with Snopes currently). The left does this, the right does this, liberals do this, conservatives to this.
Are you ready to challenge your confirmation baises? And think critically? Are you open to reading (at at intellectual and academic level) about Conspiracism?
You seem to be threatened by facts/evidence that go against your beliefs - as evidenced by your long-winded 'detailed' comment (and attempt) at trying to find flaws in the above mentioned sources. That is the normal behavior/response of someone when they are faced with facts that question their deeply held beliefs. Congratulations - you are normal.
Care to tell us what you think about 9/11? I'd be interested and it would inform my future 'consumption' of your output on this site. Like go at it; free-form. What **are** your thoughts about the events prior to, on, and shortly after that day? Don't hold back.
OK, enough of this time-wasting shit. Why are you trying to hard to convince me of your beliefs and conspiracies? I really don't care what you believe. Go bonkers and believe whatever you want.
You literally did the exact same thing in your very first reply. LOL
Have you literally/critically parsed the information uncovered as part of a FOIA request on the nature of the term "conspiracy theory"?
Just posting links to Snopes, AP, or fucking Breitbart and Fox (for all I care) proves you're just being lazy. And that you can't take the time to elucidate and articulate your own points in your own words.
And let's stick to the topic: "conspiracy theory" - the etymology or origins. The original prevalence of the term coincides exactly with the CIA's internal memo and their infiltration of numerous "legacy" media/news outlets - and - those outlets beginning to use the term regularly.
Think again about your "argument" here - like actually take a moment to think and not just hammer out a reply.
Dude, you're tiresome - why is your ego so tightly intertwined with your beliefs in your theories? So what if you're wrong? Is it the end of the world for you? You're behaving like a flat-earther now.
OK - I'm done with this discussion - you are free to spend your time however you wish, chasing down whatever theories you need to and believing whatever keeps you emotionally sane.
Have a good evening.
False flag or not, I see this setting the pro Palestinian movement back and give Trump, Rubio & the other cabinet fascists the ammo they need to come after "us" . . . .
That's one way of looking at it. Another way of looking at it is as an expansion of awareness of what the world has come to.
Things CANNOT go back to how they were before this Genocide. The world has FOREVER changed. Much about the future is going to be unpredictable and uncomfortable.
All I know is that the Genocidal state of Israel MUST BE DESTROYED (in one way or another), and MUST CEASE TO EXIST in its current form...
If you yell loud enough, I'll be convinced.
How come " as 9/11 was blowback " ? !
This is blowback from humans that are appalled by the Genocide conducted by Israel. There is MUCH MORE blowback (of similar kinds AND worse) yet to come for Israel.
Similarly, there is MUCH BLOWBACK yet to be received by the U.S. Empire for its decades it imperialist policies.
"Blowback: The Costs and Consequences of American Empire" by Chalmers Johnson (https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/40709.Blowback)
I also suggest going through the rest of the books in the "American Empire Project" [https://www.goodreads.com/series/324809-american-empire-project]
Similarly, Israel has had a huge hand in U.S. Imperialism ("Rise and Kill First: The Secret History of Israel's Targeted Assassinations" by Ronen Bergman) [https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/33598223-rise-and-kill-first]
It is only a matter of time before ORDINARY HUMANS (and the Global South) do with comes naturally to humans - revenge and retaliation - for all the oppression, exploitation, imperialism, terrorism, etc. suffered by ordinary people (and the Global South) at the hands of the U.S. Empire and Israel.
Like I said, these are the consequences of BLOWBACK.