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Rob Brown's avatar

As far as fighting algorithm manipulation goes, I recommend the following. Some of it might be obvious, but just in case it isn't:

1. Turn off autoplay on YouTube. In the past, that's spared me getting exposed to stuff like Colbert's most recent "apple-polishing" (as Matt Taibbi's put it) for the powerful. Or, if you feel like putting it less politely, substitute "balls" for "apple", and substitute "licking" for "polishing". Either way, I'm glad I didn't have to hear even a second of it.

2. If the algorithm suppresses people worth listening to, use word of mouth or retweets. Even before YouTube changed its algorithm, even before the "adpocalypse" years ago, I actually never had any shows I watch or once watched recommended to me by the algorithm. Even with Rising on The Hill, I actually first found out about it because Niko House tweeted about it positively, back in the days when Krystal & Saagar were more well-regarded on the left.

3. Don't just search for a particular topic if you don't want to hear whatever mainstream bullshit is being churned out. Instead of searching for "Ukraine" search for, say, "Ukraine" and "Max Blumenthal". Or whoever you trust to give you the straight dope. For the same reason, if you do happen to look at whatever the top stories are on Google or YouTube or whatever, make sure to remember why you're not getting your news from whichever outlets they're recommending in the first place and to search for the opinion of someone trustworthy on it. For example, one of the first things I saw when I looked at the top stories right now was about Justin Trudeau virtue signaling over Roe v. Wade, wringing his hands about how awful the Supreme Court decision was. Not that Trudeau is wrong *this* time IMHO, but if you read enough stories like that--ones which make him out to be a heroic defender of women's rights--then you might start to forget that he froze peaceful protestors' bank accounts, imprisoned others, that "In 2020, the Canadian government, citing COVID, proposed legislation 'to make it an offence to knowingly spread misinformation that could harm people.'" (via Greenwald), etc.

I don't know whether any of that is helpful to anyone who reads this, but hopefully it will be.

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J Pappas's avatar

I was totally with you until I got to the part about Trudeau. Although I am not a fan of his, I (and many, many other Canadians) wanted him to freeze the bank accounts and imprison and in fact do whatever was necessary to put down the rebellion centred in Ottawa. Most of us were also happy about the job the federal government did regarding Covid. I assume you are not Canadian?

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Rob Brown's avatar

It was a lot of honking and blocking roads, it was not a dangerous rebellion or anything.

And while I admit that if I were living in a city with blocked roads and honking that I would probably hate it, it would be overkill to fucking FREEZE PEOPLE'S BANK ACCOUNTS AND ARREST THEM FOR IT. That was tyrannical by the Trudeau government, and no, I don't want to reconsider my words there. "Tyrannical" fits nicely.

I'm a dual citizen of the US and Canada, living in Canada btw.

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russian_bot's avatar

"It was a lot of honking and blocking roads," - that's what I understood it was. And though from the point of view of the govt it was ok to squash it by whatever means (let's not kid ourselves with all that "western democracy" shit) it's illustrative how the freedom-loving Canadians ran to support those measures.

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Mamaluigi7's avatar

I guess Covid and people dying doesn’t mean anything to you.

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Kevin's avatar

You are happy about COVID response in Canada? While I bought it at first, the manipulation of the Canadian psyche from 19 to omnichron proves Caitlens point. When the head doctor Tambot recommends glory holes to prevent the spread, Canadians have lost their minds. I wont even bother to go down the list of purposely done destructions of freedoms. The CBC is the very organization that Caitlen speaks about. CTV are turds in a punchbowl. They choose the liberals to protect their telecom monopoly. The big 5 banks are in it as well. My plans include a safe run to another country, something I would never have considered 10 years ago.

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Rob Brown's avatar

In addition to all of that, nobody should be happy at all about there being actual laws on the books saying that you can be arrested and maybe imprisoned if I talk about how the vaccines can cause myocarditis or whatever truths are being labeled "misinformation" by the government.

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Mamaluigi7's avatar

World Socialist News would like to have a word with you: https://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2022/02/21/poli-f21.html

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anti-republocrat's avatar

I used to think Canada was almost a Utopia, but now I understand that "most of you" don't even see the chains that bind you. There was no "rebellion." The truckers were very peaceful.

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Rob Brown's avatar

Yeah, when Covid started I was watching the US and thinking "Damn, I'm glad I don't live down there!" And then ol' Justin decided to prove to the world that he could be just as authoritarian as Biden. At which point I thought "Well, so much for Canada being better..."

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Mamaluigi7's avatar

Okay you and Rob Brown sound like Libertarian a-holes, I give you this quote:

“Libertarians claim to be a radical philosophers but are really as bourgeoisie as they can get. Ultimately, all libertarians are really interested in is defending their petty, white, middle class interests.

Most Libertarians begin life as a spoiled upper-middle class and very white teen who fails to comprehend that not everyone else in the world is a spoiled upper-middle class white teen.

At first, the young libertardian-to-be has only a vague dissatisfaction. He begins to ask himself questions like:

"What political philosophy can I both bastardize and miss the point of, so that I can justify being an even more selfish prick than I am now?"

"How can I reconcile that I hate those who I deem aren't productive, with the fact that I don't need a job because daddy gives me a generous allowance?"

"Why do we even need government? Surely almost seven billion people can all police themselves, right?"

The answer comes to them in two little words. Ayn Rand. With sixth-grade level vocabulary, and fourth-grade level philosophy, Rand's book have all the emotional depth of a two-year old's temper tantrum. "MINE!!!" Rand is their holy prophet. She speaks the words so perfectly, the words they want to hear.

"You don't lack compassion! You just want people to get by on their own merits!", She says. "You're not a selfish asshole! You just have a sense of rational self-interest!", She affirms. "You have no obligation to the society in which you live! Governments are only there to lift up those not as good as you!", She declares.

And lo, it was good. Because if there is one thing that makes financially comfortable white people feel good about themselves, it is that they earned the benefits of being financially comfortable, clearly by their own merits.

It wasn't daddy's money that bought you your head start in life. It wasn't the better schools, the better nutrition, the better neighborhoods. It wasn't the country you were born in, or the system of laws that protected and to this day protects you. It wasn't the various government agencies making sure you have licensed doctors, clean drinking water, or safety standards for vehicles.

No, my young privileged white boy, you did it all. You, and only you, are responsible for all your success. And anyone who isn't as well off just didn't work as hard. And the government can only take from a productive member of society like you to give to the leeches. And there should be no laws. And even though there are laws, they don't really apply to you, because you're special. Be as selfish as you want. It's all you.

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anti-republocrat's avatar

Don't ASSume you know my thoughts. You don't. You're a marionette in chains. Trudeau, a representative of the corporate elitist Klaus Schwab yanks your strings and you are too blind to see it. Strange that you should show up on Caitlin's substack, because you are obviously too stupid to learn anything from her. She's telling you about the strings and the narratives (like WSWS's nonsense that the truckers are right wingers and not workers). Tell me, why does WSWS say Omicron is worse than any previous wave? Vaccine acceptance in Canada is very high. I would have thought Covid would be stamped out in Canada by now. Why are infection and death rates in Africa so low?

Yes, I support the Bill of Right and the Charter of Canadian Rights and Freedoms, as well as a US Constitutional Amendment to deny those natural rights to corporations, which currently control both governments, the very definition of fascism. You are a totalitarian lunatic, as are all communists and fascists.

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Rob Brown's avatar

WSWS actually says Omicron was worse than Delta or the original?

In addition to perpetuating the myth that everybody who has reservations about the vaccine is "right-wing"?

I'm glad I never bothered reading it like I used to read The Intercept.

Finally, one doesn't have to be "libertarian" to support a protest. Protests are, by design, meant to inconvenience people. If you had a protest which everybody could easily ignore, everybody would ignore it and nothing would change. Maybe you think this isn't something that was worth protesting, "Mamaluigi7", but you'd be singing a different tune if you'd been injured by the vaccine as many people have by now. And FFS, last year the Ontario government actually came out and said that Moderna was too risky for people aged 18-24...after they'd already injected tons of 18-24 year-olds with it. https://www.ctvnews.ca/health/coronavirus/ontario-recommends-people-aged-18-to-24-take-pfizer-over-moderna-1.5605442

P.S. "Privileged" huh? You know what real privilege is? Real privilege is saying to yourself on election day "Sure, I'll vote for the Liberals (if in Canada) or for the Democrats (if in the US) because my life has always been perfectly fine and none of their decisions have fucked up my life at all." THAT is your privilege, bitch. You never got locked up because of the Crime Bill, you never lost your business or your job because of lockdowns or because of trade deals, you never had your bank account frozen, you never had the government build a pipeline on your land, and you sure as hell don't seem to care about the fact that both Trudeau and Biden are killing Yemenis and Palestinians by proxy with their support of Saudi Arabia and Israel.

Get yourself a conscience and maybe you'll stop voting for these fascists who harm so many, who harm as many people as Trump or Harper ever did. It doesn't matter if their policies don't negatively affect YOU. You should care about those people their policies DO negatively affect. Or are you going to call the First Nations people in Canada and Native Americans in the States "privileged"? Are you going to call the large percentage of African-Americans who quite understandably don't trust the government "privileged"?

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Mamaluigi7's avatar

List of Things Libertarians Hate

Calendars, clocks

Standard weights and measures

Sick days

Maternity/Paternity leave (What do you mean, America is the only developed country in the world not to have paid maternity leave? They're all commies!)

Overtime pay

Minimum wage

Electricity

Clean water

Clean air

State and national parks, playgrounds, Fish and Game Wildlife Services (We should be able to kill all the cute critters in the forest if we want to! ESPECIALLY the endangered ones!)

Roads and infrastructure

Postal service

Safe workplaces, OSHA

Health inspectors, all federal workers (see "postal service")

Welfare, unemployment benefits

Public schools

Seat belts and airbags

Cops (protection rackets and the mafia are far more libertarian)

Fire stations (ESPECIALLY volunteer firefighters)

Taxes (even if they don't pay 'em because they have no job and live in their parents' basement)

Unions

Public transport

Food free of salmonella

Nutrition facts

Vaccines

Safe medicine

Poor people

black people

women

SOCHULIZM!!!!!!!

Charities, any altruistic behavior.

Unemployment benefits

Gaining more than 3% of the vote

History

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Mamaluigi7's avatar

“This morning I was awoken by my alarm clock powered by electricity generated by the public power monopoly regulated by the US Department of Energy.

I then took a shower in the clean water provided by the municipal water utility. Then, I brushed my teeth with that water, filtered to standards set by the EPA and my state.

After that, I turned on the TV to one of the FCC regulated channels to see what the National Weather Service of the National Oceanographic and Atmospheric Administration determined the weather was going to be like using satellites designed, built, and launched by the National Aeronautics and Space Administration. I watched this while eating my breakfast of US Department of Agriculture inspected food and taking the drugs which have been determined as safe by the Food and Drug Administration.

At the appropriate time as regulated by the US Congress and kept accurate by the National Institute of Standards and Technology and the US Naval Observatory, I get into my National Highway Traffic Safety Administration approved automobile and set out to work on the roads built by the local, state, and federal Departments of Transportation, possibly stopping to purchase additional fuel of a quality level determined by the Environmental Protection Agency, using legal tender issued by the Federal Reserve Bank and printed by the Federal Bureau of Engraving and Printing. On the way out the door I deposit any mail I have to be sent out via the US Postal Service and drop the kids off at the public school.

I park my car on the street, paved and maintained by the Department of Transportation, and put quarters issued by the United States Mint into the parking meter.

Then, after spending another day not being maimed or killed at work thanks to the workplace regulations imposed by the Department of Labor and the Occupational Safety and Health Administration, I drive back to my house which has not burned down in my absence because of the state and local building codes and the fire marshal's inspection, and which has not been plundered of all its valuables thanks to the local police department.

I then log onto the Internet which was developed by the Defense Advanced Research Projects Administration and post on freerepublic and fox news forums about how SOCIALISM in medicine is BAD because the government can't do anything right. Keep government out of my Medicare!”

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Mamaluigi7's avatar

You can criticize Trudeau without being an anti-vaxxer or Covid denier nutjob.

Also the starving African children would like to speak with you.

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Mamaluigi7's avatar

“Strange that you should show up on Caitlin's substack, because you are obviously too stupid to learn anything from her.”

I do, she is just not a libertarian like you think she is, she also supports Socialism and Communism.

https://twitter.com/caitoz/status/1297189068103487490?s=21&t=8vl7MEnr0ReA5k470b-emw

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anti-republocrat's avatar

She does, however, speak against "propaganda," "censorship" and the elite narrative. You apparently love all three since you defend Trudeau. I never claimed Caitlin is a libertarian. I don't think she understands there's such a thing as a left-libertarian, who understands there is a difference between individual human beings and corporate entities.

In one of your posts you extolled the great benefits of government-regulated monopolies. Defending private monopolies is quite reactionary. Governments should own monopolies, with any profits accruing to government to fund anticipated expansion or otherwise returned as rebates to rate payer.

Labels are a convenient way to try to pigeon-hole people. To the extent Caitlin falls for it and refuses to listen to certain points of view, I criticize her. I don't agree with her all the time, but probably much more often than you. She is not an authoritarian and believes people should think for themselves. You spout nothing but authoritarian talking points; not an original thought in your pea brain.

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Scott William James Wright's avatar

I am Canadian - and you have stated that "Most of Us were happy about the job the Canadian government did...." How do you claim to speak for Most of Us? What you have stated is false & misleading. I do NOT agree with the Governments Mandates & I DO Support the Freedom Convoy. I think you are actually unaware what Trudeau is up to - & it has nothing to do with keeping the Canadian Population Safe. For Example, why was the Emergencies Act used? No One in the Federal Government can provide a reason. WE have been betrayed and once again our supposedly guaranteed Charter of Rights & Freedoms have been trampled on to excuse the various levels of governments mismanagement of Everything including Covid. SWJW

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J Pappas's avatar

You support the "freedom convoy" enough said.

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Scott William James Wright's avatar

What an absurd comment - the Freedom Convoy was the most peaceful, non-aggressive & perfect example of democratic action. Only shut down by our Lying/Cheating & Useless "Leaders". A Shameful Display. SWJW.

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