The Democratic Primaries have been rigged three cycles in a row. The government of the US is uniquely unresponsive to the demands and preferences of the governed.
No one voted for endless wars. No one voted for private corporations to have private courts from which they can sue private citizens. Only a very few people at the top voted for tax cuts for Billionaires and tax increases on workers.
Thanks to a series of Supreme Court decisions, money is speech and corporations are people. There is no equal protection or semblance of one man / one vote.
The United States is neither a Democracy nor Representative Republic. The US is, by Mussolini's own definition, a Fascist State run by a system of inverted totalitarianism. Both 'wings' of the party are right by varying degrees.
"B-b-but it's not democracy. Real democracy has never been tried."
Are things what they are in theory, or how they turn out in practice?
Assuming (assuming!) democracy always devolved into anarcho-tyranny, would you be for putting the idea to rest forever or would you persist in trying it out?
The Greeks invented the system, and soon after were ringing alarm bells warning people against its dangers.
"No one voted for endless wars." - was there an item to tick for that?
It is democracy in the sense that these politicians/governments are put there/set up with the participation of people. Obviously, a majority of them. Now, you can try twisting "democracy" to suit your own views, but the facts are there, right in front of you.
Say you are starving, and given the choice of eating a shit sandwich or a puke salad. You have a choice; 1. starve or 2. Pretend the shit sandwich or puke salad is the best option, depending on your personal preferences. I guess if you choose number 2, one could argue you were given a free, fair choice.
Yeah, we kind of do. Year after year, we are offered a shit sandwich or a puke salad, and anything appetizing is taken off the menu. This is especially true for the Democrats.
We were brought to this situation by a series of Supreme Court decisions which made corporations people, money speech, and ruled that the parties are not accountable to their voters and essentially private corporations/
Explain in detail. Since you are not forced physically to vote and not threatened by any government action - no fines, no nothing. If you're an American, that is.
Bot - your point is that we live in a democracy because we are allowed to vote. My point is that we are given two consistently odious choices of who we may vote for (or we can sit it out) - and as it turns out, the two odious choices we vote for are owned by the same corporations, and will do what those corporate entities tell them to do. The difference will largely be about style.
The choice between Coke and Pepsi is irrelevant. It's still high-fructose corn syrup.
This is not democracy. In fact, it's not even really consumer choice.
You're right. De facto, it's not a democracy. But it still is an *ostensible* democracy, which is where the battle must be joined. I and so many others are having epic philosophical 'wars' among friends and in our own families.
Even highly intelligent people are now bamboozled to rationalize the normalization of lying, and believe that nothing can really be done about the consequences of this development. But lying (common as it is and always will be), and the consequent treating people primarily as objects to be manipulated instead of (moral) equals to communicate with, is at the very center of social breakdowns of all kinds.
In what way is this 'democracy'?
The Democratic Primaries have been rigged three cycles in a row. The government of the US is uniquely unresponsive to the demands and preferences of the governed.
No one voted for endless wars. No one voted for private corporations to have private courts from which they can sue private citizens. Only a very few people at the top voted for tax cuts for Billionaires and tax increases on workers.
Thanks to a series of Supreme Court decisions, money is speech and corporations are people. There is no equal protection or semblance of one man / one vote.
The United States is neither a Democracy nor Representative Republic. The US is, by Mussolini's own definition, a Fascist State run by a system of inverted totalitarianism. Both 'wings' of the party are right by varying degrees.
Good to see the cooler heads are represented here.
"B-b-but it's not democracy. Real democracy has never been tried."
Are things what they are in theory, or how they turn out in practice?
Assuming (assuming!) democracy always devolved into anarcho-tyranny, would you be for putting the idea to rest forever or would you persist in trying it out?
The Greeks invented the system, and soon after were ringing alarm bells warning people against its dangers.
"No one voted for endless wars." - was there an item to tick for that?
It is democracy in the sense that these politicians/governments are put there/set up with the participation of people. Obviously, a majority of them. Now, you can try twisting "democracy" to suit your own views, but the facts are there, right in front of you.
Say you are starving, and given the choice of eating a shit sandwich or a puke salad. You have a choice; 1. starve or 2. Pretend the shit sandwich or puke salad is the best option, depending on your personal preferences. I guess if you choose number 2, one could argue you were given a free, fair choice.
Except that it's not a choice. You don't have to eat your vote.
Yeah, we kind of do. Year after year, we are offered a shit sandwich or a puke salad, and anything appetizing is taken off the menu. This is especially true for the Democrats.
We were brought to this situation by a series of Supreme Court decisions which made corporations people, money speech, and ruled that the parties are not accountable to their voters and essentially private corporations/
"Yeah, we kind of do." - how so?
Explain in detail. Since you are not forced physically to vote and not threatened by any government action - no fines, no nothing. If you're an American, that is.
Bot - your point is that we live in a democracy because we are allowed to vote. My point is that we are given two consistently odious choices of who we may vote for (or we can sit it out) - and as it turns out, the two odious choices we vote for are owned by the same corporations, and will do what those corporate entities tell them to do. The difference will largely be about style.
The choice between Coke and Pepsi is irrelevant. It's still high-fructose corn syrup.
This is not democracy. In fact, it's not even really consumer choice.
You're right. De facto, it's not a democracy. But it still is an *ostensible* democracy, which is where the battle must be joined. I and so many others are having epic philosophical 'wars' among friends and in our own families.
Even highly intelligent people are now bamboozled to rationalize the normalization of lying, and believe that nothing can really be done about the consequences of this development. But lying (common as it is and always will be), and the consequent treating people primarily as objects to be manipulated instead of (moral) equals to communicate with, is at the very center of social breakdowns of all kinds.