I agree with you Lisa! I don't understand why some groups of people keep minimizing the significance of Jan 6.
I may not agree with a lot of the over-the-top rhetoric of "revolution, insurrection, overthrow of Government, overthrow of democracy, etc.", but it is and will always be a watershed moment in American history.
I cannot imagine something like this having happened under any other US President. So the obvious question to ask is - what is it about Trump that brought about this event? Was it "the election was stolen" lies con that he used on his supporters? Was it inciteful speech and rhetoric? Was it something about his personality?
I am constantly amazed by how many people continue to be conned by Trump's fake "concern for America", his fake "care about his people", etc.
(Not to mention that he is a textbook case of a fascistic personality)
It would be disastrous for him to win. He's a sociopathic criminal and a traitor who's encouraged the open revival of the racist Confederate mindset. How deeply discouraging that our only other option is a fanatical Zionist for whom the death of 30,000 people imprisoned in a ghetto is of no import.
Completely agree! Hence I would vote for a third candidate in the 2024 election - the only ones worthy of my vote are Cornel West and Jill Stein. Being a realist, I know that neither of them will win (which is the real tragedy for Americans AND the rest of the world).
My husband says that these third party candidates need to win lower races and gather support before jumping into the presidential race. It's just a vanity project for all of them. They have zero chance of winning and a vote for them helps dump.
I feel responsible for making this terrible choice. Both are all in with Israel, the whole Congress owned by AIPAC. The propaganda and censorship Israel and its friends is massive, complex has succeeded for 75 years.
The Republicans have their Project 2025 plans, and everything else they're already doing is a threat to women, non-whites, our planet/environment/habitation for all species, the wealth of the bottom 99 percent, our basic freedoms to say and read what we want, the integrity of voting rights and our elections. Vote Blue No Matter Who is the smarter choice, all awful things considered.
(1) RFK Jr. is also running as a third party candidate. He pretends to be a Democrat, but he seems to be a full-blown Republican (like Joe Manchin, Kyrsten Sinema, Tulsi Gabbard, etc.). Which means that a lot of Republicans and conservatives will vote for him (hopefully), which means those votes for him will be votes stolen from Trump. This would, IMHO, more than balance out the votes lost for Democrats by supporting Cornel West/Jill Stein.
(2) Another option is to NOT vote at all. Considering how bad the choices are for 2024, I consider this to be a very valid option.
(3) My conscience will not allow me to vote for Biden, regardless of who is running against him. (The Israel-Palestine issue is an extremely deep and personal issue for me).
(4) From what I see of the Biden and Trump presidencies, Biden has been really bad for the whole world, while Trump has been really bad for the US. If I have to choose between the World and the US, I choose the World. Think about it - 350 million people versus 7.5 billion people.
(5) Unlike what most people think, Trump is as much of a supporter of Israel as Biden is, if not more. Also, it is unlikely that he would be able to have enough of an impact on the trajectory of US Foreign Policy. Hence, for this (and a hundred other) reasons, I could never vote for Trump or someone like him.
So my options are: vote for Cornel West/Jill Stein if they are on the ballot. If not, I would not vote.
Unfortunately, there are no morally acceptable solutions for the US 2024 elections. I also believe in this specific case that there are no right/wrong answers, and no preferable outcomes (IMHO).
Trump will just accelerate the demise of the US - not from external forces, but from internal forces within the country (i.e. a civil war of sorts between liberals and conservatives, left and right, etc.). Biden will do the same through his alienating the rest of the world against the US, though at a slower pace than Trump.
Either way, what we have is a lose-lose situation - the only winners will be the "power elite".
What concerns me more is the shift towards the far-right and fascism that I see happening in many parts of the World - Europe, India, South America, Africa, Middle East. 60 countries are going to be having major elections in 2024. 4 billion people will be voting in 2024 to choose their nation's leaders. It will be interesting to watch in which direction the world turns towards more - a more far-right and fascistic direction OR a more liberal and tolerant one.
But the GOP/dump absolutely represent the more fascistic trend. I am torn, but as dump would be the exact same as Biden with Israel, though stuffing his family's pockets more, I have to try to beat the fascists, rather than abstain. I have focused a lot of energy toward revealing the truth about Israel and Palestine in person and on social media. Many reposts have been removed by Zuckerberg. I've been kind of shocked that more liberal boomers aren't seeing the light though. I get your moral stance, but it's my duty to fight the hellacious GOP. I will never have empathy for Israel again and wish we could break their stranglehold on us. It's an ungodly choice to have to make and I've wavered. Maybe somehow they'll both be "unable to run." 🤞🤞🤞
Trump's elected, but his win is due to Russian interference, a lie pushed by the democrats, but no one has been held accountable. The democrats win the house during his presidency so they impeach him. He's running against Biden, and there's talk about Biden's son's laptop that could undermine his chances of winning so some 50 CIA agents sign on to the lie its Russian disinformation, and on and on. Who trusts anything the democrats have to say? Jan 6 comm, was totally unconstitutional, and it's where little miss Cheney got to stroll her father around, a man who pushed us into a war that killed and displaced millions, on a lie, not to mention Guantanamo and his black sites. During the unconstitutional Jan 6 comm 3 republicans oversee the democrat's charges against Trump, and all hate his guts. You don't like him fine, but what happened during his term in office further undermined the fragile democracy we already have. Think about it, he wanted to get along with Russia, and the dems didn't want to here that, since under Obama we supported the coup in Ukraine whose purpose was to get rid of Putin. Norm Chomsky at the beginning of the Russia/Ukrainian war, said there was only one statesmen who could stop it, and that was Trump. He's not all good, but he is not all bad, and you can't believe what they say when from the beginning of his presidency they wanted to overturn his win.
Sorry, Fran, but I just couldn't disagree more. Have you read the GOP plans for if he wins? Project 2025?
I agree with you Lisa! I don't understand why some groups of people keep minimizing the significance of Jan 6.
I may not agree with a lot of the over-the-top rhetoric of "revolution, insurrection, overthrow of Government, overthrow of democracy, etc.", but it is and will always be a watershed moment in American history.
I cannot imagine something like this having happened under any other US President. So the obvious question to ask is - what is it about Trump that brought about this event? Was it "the election was stolen" lies con that he used on his supporters? Was it inciteful speech and rhetoric? Was it something about his personality?
I am constantly amazed by how many people continue to be conned by Trump's fake "concern for America", his fake "care about his people", etc.
(Not to mention that he is a textbook case of a fascistic personality)
It would be disastrous for him to win. He's a sociopathic criminal and a traitor who's encouraged the open revival of the racist Confederate mindset. How deeply discouraging that our only other option is a fanatical Zionist for whom the death of 30,000 people imprisoned in a ghetto is of no import.
Completely agree! Hence I would vote for a third candidate in the 2024 election - the only ones worthy of my vote are Cornel West and Jill Stein. Being a realist, I know that neither of them will win (which is the real tragedy for Americans AND the rest of the world).
My husband says that these third party candidates need to win lower races and gather support before jumping into the presidential race. It's just a vanity project for all of them. They have zero chance of winning and a vote for them helps dump.
I feel responsible for making this terrible choice. Both are all in with Israel, the whole Congress owned by AIPAC. The propaganda and censorship Israel and its friends is massive, complex has succeeded for 75 years.
The Republicans have their Project 2025 plans, and everything else they're already doing is a threat to women, non-whites, our planet/environment/habitation for all species, the wealth of the bottom 99 percent, our basic freedoms to say and read what we want, the integrity of voting rights and our elections. Vote Blue No Matter Who is the smarter choice, all awful things considered.
I agree with your husband's assessment.
But here are some other things to consider:
(1) RFK Jr. is also running as a third party candidate. He pretends to be a Democrat, but he seems to be a full-blown Republican (like Joe Manchin, Kyrsten Sinema, Tulsi Gabbard, etc.). Which means that a lot of Republicans and conservatives will vote for him (hopefully), which means those votes for him will be votes stolen from Trump. This would, IMHO, more than balance out the votes lost for Democrats by supporting Cornel West/Jill Stein.
(2) Another option is to NOT vote at all. Considering how bad the choices are for 2024, I consider this to be a very valid option.
(3) My conscience will not allow me to vote for Biden, regardless of who is running against him. (The Israel-Palestine issue is an extremely deep and personal issue for me).
(4) From what I see of the Biden and Trump presidencies, Biden has been really bad for the whole world, while Trump has been really bad for the US. If I have to choose between the World and the US, I choose the World. Think about it - 350 million people versus 7.5 billion people.
(5) Unlike what most people think, Trump is as much of a supporter of Israel as Biden is, if not more. Also, it is unlikely that he would be able to have enough of an impact on the trajectory of US Foreign Policy. Hence, for this (and a hundred other) reasons, I could never vote for Trump or someone like him.
So my options are: vote for Cornel West/Jill Stein if they are on the ballot. If not, I would not vote.
Unfortunately, there are no morally acceptable solutions for the US 2024 elections. I also believe in this specific case that there are no right/wrong answers, and no preferable outcomes (IMHO).
Trump will just accelerate the demise of the US - not from external forces, but from internal forces within the country (i.e. a civil war of sorts between liberals and conservatives, left and right, etc.). Biden will do the same through his alienating the rest of the world against the US, though at a slower pace than Trump.
Either way, what we have is a lose-lose situation - the only winners will be the "power elite".
What concerns me more is the shift towards the far-right and fascism that I see happening in many parts of the World - Europe, India, South America, Africa, Middle East. 60 countries are going to be having major elections in 2024. 4 billion people will be voting in 2024 to choose their nation's leaders. It will be interesting to watch in which direction the world turns towards more - a more far-right and fascistic direction OR a more liberal and tolerant one.
Who do you think Mearsheimer would endorse?
But the GOP/dump absolutely represent the more fascistic trend. I am torn, but as dump would be the exact same as Biden with Israel, though stuffing his family's pockets more, I have to try to beat the fascists, rather than abstain. I have focused a lot of energy toward revealing the truth about Israel and Palestine in person and on social media. Many reposts have been removed by Zuckerberg. I've been kind of shocked that more liberal boomers aren't seeing the light though. I get your moral stance, but it's my duty to fight the hellacious GOP. I will never have empathy for Israel again and wish we could break their stranglehold on us. It's an ungodly choice to have to make and I've wavered. Maybe somehow they'll both be "unable to run." 🤞🤞🤞
Trump's elected, but his win is due to Russian interference, a lie pushed by the democrats, but no one has been held accountable. The democrats win the house during his presidency so they impeach him. He's running against Biden, and there's talk about Biden's son's laptop that could undermine his chances of winning so some 50 CIA agents sign on to the lie its Russian disinformation, and on and on. Who trusts anything the democrats have to say? Jan 6 comm, was totally unconstitutional, and it's where little miss Cheney got to stroll her father around, a man who pushed us into a war that killed and displaced millions, on a lie, not to mention Guantanamo and his black sites. During the unconstitutional Jan 6 comm 3 republicans oversee the democrat's charges against Trump, and all hate his guts. You don't like him fine, but what happened during his term in office further undermined the fragile democracy we already have. Think about it, he wanted to get along with Russia, and the dems didn't want to here that, since under Obama we supported the coup in Ukraine whose purpose was to get rid of Putin. Norm Chomsky at the beginning of the Russia/Ukrainian war, said there was only one statesmen who could stop it, and that was Trump. He's not all good, but he is not all bad, and you can't believe what they say when from the beginning of his presidency they wanted to overturn his win.
I can see your mind is made up and so is mine.