I do not agree with the extreme police tactics. And yes they will not be rolled back after the pandemic. I also understand why Victoria is trying to get a hold of covid before it becomes endemic, and the far righters who have hijacked the demonstrations are trying to ensure Covid becomes endemic. These are two separate issues.
Too late, it became endemic last year. "An analysis of more than 50,000 real-life SARS-CoV-2 genomes isolated from patient samples further showed that most of these virus mutations were already circulating, albeit at very low levels in the infected human populations. These results show that SARS-CoV-2 can mutate its spike proteins to evade antibodies, and that these mutations are already present in some virus mutants circulating in the human population." https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33112236/ That's 50,000 variants, since October 2020. There are likely to be a lot more by now.
It doesn't matter if you're vaccinated or not, if you don't have natural T-cell immunity, you're not going to be immune to new variants. The vaccines all focus on the spike protein, and there are - as of three months ago - over 1400 variants in the US alone which can evade the vaccines. What the vaccines do is filter out the variants for which they're made, so if you get infected with a soup of alpha, wild type, and delta variants as the major components, plus hundreds of other mutations as minor components, the vaccines will filter out the alpha and wild type viruses, and leave the Delta and the rest alone - and *those* will reproduce. The dominant strain will then, by natural selection, be the Delta strain, accompanied by the rest, and those will be spread to others. So let's say we get a Delta booster shot. That filters out the Delta variant, and leaves the rest, including (say) the Lambda variant alone to reproduce, and be spread. So we get a Lambda booster shot, and that takes care of the Lambda, but the Epsilon variant isn't touched, so we need another booster. And this could continue on for 20 years, until the variant names fill the page. On the other hand, natural immunity rules - Emory University School of Medicine: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8253687/
Another thing: betacoronaviruses infect animal reservoirs, where mutation is common. This includes house cats and dogs, as well as other mammalian wildlife. So to get complete control, you'd have to vaccinate every cat that comes into contact with humans, including strays and feral cats. Good luck with that. https://wwwnc.cdc.gov/eid/article/27/4/20-3945_article
The health issue is that Covid results in severe symptoms that will see a number of people hospitalised, in ICU, or dead. Vaccines reduce the likelihood of infection, and if infected, reduce the incidence of severe symptoms. This is the point of vaccines, as well as helping slow the spread of disease. Basic public health measures (masks, distancing, sanitation practices) are likely to be more effective to slow spread, though best is both.
Mutation happens naturally, and the more people with Covid, the more mutation occurs. At the moment, with large populations of unvaccinated, there is likely to be a lot more people in those populations getting Covid, so that will be the source of most mutations. Vaccines do not cause mutation. As you say, there are tens of thousands of mutations. It is what allows people to determine where a virus comes from. Most of the mutations are insignificant. Only a few are "variants of interest" or "variants of concern". That's why we can say a virus is Delta, but with minor variations that say it came from the UK vs the US west coast. The named ones, the "variants of concern" are the ones that may become dominant.
At the moment, contagiousness is the main determinant of viral dominance. That's why Delta is the main viral strain found everywhere. As most of the world develops antibodies (through vaccine or surviving infection), ability to evade immune reaction will become more important in making a strain dominant. This is the case whether the immune response is from vaccine or infection. Exposure to the virus is more likely to create a robust immune response. But vaccinated people will also be exposed, as the virus spreads. This will result in increased immune response.
Ultimately, there will be shifts in our antibodies, as the virus changes. Vaccines will become less effective, and new vaccine variations will be needed, as with flu virus. But the point of vaccines will be to reduce symptoms, as with rotovirus. This will mean hospitals are not overwhelmed, and potentially, that there will be few people (not no people) becoming seriously ill or dying of Covid.
Covid is not endemic in Australia yet, though it may be endemic in NSW and possibly Victoria. Other states have few cases of community transmission, and Tasmania has none. Overall, Australia has not had much Covid until recently, and it's been possible to eliminate incursions before it spread far.
Not a fact. Sorry. Try talking to a few medical professionals. The doctors are being silenced, exactly like the legal profession was while Wall Street grabbed all the homes with fake documents.
But, do continue with listening to what MSM says.
Why are you so worried if you are vaxxed? The people who are NOT worried are the people who have not been vaxxed. Don't you find that interesting?
You ask "Why are you so worried if you're vaxxed"? I'm not. I'm concerned about people who want to get vaxxed, and are unable to, like most people in the Global South. I care about folks who are immunosuppressed including children. Children are winding up in ICU. I care about folks who will get long haul covid if they are lucky, (not dying) and that's no picnic. I guess you don't give a toss about community or facts about vaccinations keeping people out of ICU. You'd rather just throw a tanty about government , even though it's not government that is the issue here. Corrupt governments existed before COVID and they use any disaster to take away rights for the public. That's what they do. Militarised police didn't suddenly come into existence when COVID happened. They have been increasing in Australia since 9/11. Govt and militarised police are a separate issue to the fact that vaccinations keep people out of ICU and will slow down the variant mutations since there will be a smaller and smaller population who will not be contracting it. Yes vaxxed people can carry the virus, that's because we have more mutations. Mutations are naturally occurring in viruses. So while there's huge populations that are unvaxxed, mutations will continue to survive and become more virulent. So one day, you may become a victim of a powerful mutation because your body is not able to deal with it. Remember that next time you go pushing scienceless information.
How awesome that you are connected with all the ICUs across the globe! What a feat!
Do I believe the medical professionals and the doctors being silenced vs the MSM? I believe the medical professionals who tell me the majority of people in hospital with Covid now are vaxxed.
If you wish to believe the lying MSM, go right ahead.
I also note you claim you are the "true left" (in your podcast) but sit here and shame me for my opinions. You are following the totalitarian authoritarian propaganda that the unvaxxed are "uncaring, unloving and generally horrible people." Good on ya.
Unless you think there's a global conspiracy between all the ICUs in the world, then you are simply denying evidence based outcomes in the hospital settings. Okie dokie.
Karen, I think you appear to be very committed to intentionally misunderstanding what I am saying to you ( or you have a comprehension problem) which makes me think your engagement with me is in bad faith, so I'm going to leave it here.
I do not agree with the extreme police tactics. And yes they will not be rolled back after the pandemic. I also understand why Victoria is trying to get a hold of covid before it becomes endemic, and the far righters who have hijacked the demonstrations are trying to ensure Covid becomes endemic. These are two separate issues.
Too late, it became endemic last year. "An analysis of more than 50,000 real-life SARS-CoV-2 genomes isolated from patient samples further showed that most of these virus mutations were already circulating, albeit at very low levels in the infected human populations. These results show that SARS-CoV-2 can mutate its spike proteins to evade antibodies, and that these mutations are already present in some virus mutants circulating in the human population." https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33112236/ That's 50,000 variants, since October 2020. There are likely to be a lot more by now.
It doesn't matter if you're vaccinated or not, if you don't have natural T-cell immunity, you're not going to be immune to new variants. The vaccines all focus on the spike protein, and there are - as of three months ago - over 1400 variants in the US alone which can evade the vaccines. What the vaccines do is filter out the variants for which they're made, so if you get infected with a soup of alpha, wild type, and delta variants as the major components, plus hundreds of other mutations as minor components, the vaccines will filter out the alpha and wild type viruses, and leave the Delta and the rest alone - and *those* will reproduce. The dominant strain will then, by natural selection, be the Delta strain, accompanied by the rest, and those will be spread to others. So let's say we get a Delta booster shot. That filters out the Delta variant, and leaves the rest, including (say) the Lambda variant alone to reproduce, and be spread. So we get a Lambda booster shot, and that takes care of the Lambda, but the Epsilon variant isn't touched, so we need another booster. And this could continue on for 20 years, until the variant names fill the page. On the other hand, natural immunity rules - Emory University School of Medicine: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8253687/
Another thing: betacoronaviruses infect animal reservoirs, where mutation is common. This includes house cats and dogs, as well as other mammalian wildlife. So to get complete control, you'd have to vaccinate every cat that comes into contact with humans, including strays and feral cats. Good luck with that. https://wwwnc.cdc.gov/eid/article/27/4/20-3945_article
You probably know this, so this is for others.
The health issue is that Covid results in severe symptoms that will see a number of people hospitalised, in ICU, or dead. Vaccines reduce the likelihood of infection, and if infected, reduce the incidence of severe symptoms. This is the point of vaccines, as well as helping slow the spread of disease. Basic public health measures (masks, distancing, sanitation practices) are likely to be more effective to slow spread, though best is both.
Mutation happens naturally, and the more people with Covid, the more mutation occurs. At the moment, with large populations of unvaccinated, there is likely to be a lot more people in those populations getting Covid, so that will be the source of most mutations. Vaccines do not cause mutation. As you say, there are tens of thousands of mutations. It is what allows people to determine where a virus comes from. Most of the mutations are insignificant. Only a few are "variants of interest" or "variants of concern". That's why we can say a virus is Delta, but with minor variations that say it came from the UK vs the US west coast. The named ones, the "variants of concern" are the ones that may become dominant.
At the moment, contagiousness is the main determinant of viral dominance. That's why Delta is the main viral strain found everywhere. As most of the world develops antibodies (through vaccine or surviving infection), ability to evade immune reaction will become more important in making a strain dominant. This is the case whether the immune response is from vaccine or infection. Exposure to the virus is more likely to create a robust immune response. But vaccinated people will also be exposed, as the virus spreads. This will result in increased immune response.
Ultimately, there will be shifts in our antibodies, as the virus changes. Vaccines will become less effective, and new vaccine variations will be needed, as with flu virus. But the point of vaccines will be to reduce symptoms, as with rotovirus. This will mean hospitals are not overwhelmed, and potentially, that there will be few people (not no people) becoming seriously ill or dying of Covid.
You spew a lot of what the MSM is dishing out. You must not have talked to any medical professionals who have been silenced. You might try doing so.
It’s not a vaccine, better make that clear first and foremost. It’s gene therapy gone wrong but doing everything ‘they’ could ask for…
Covid is not endemic in Australia yet, though it may be endemic in NSW and possibly Victoria. Other states have few cases of community transmission, and Tasmania has none. Overall, Australia has not had much Covid until recently, and it's been possible to eliminate incursions before it spread far.
#LMAO! You don’t want to be far-right for sure, line up and get the jab! Genius.
FACT: The vaccine keeps people out of ICU. A fact that anti-vaxxers don't like to acknowledge.
Not a fact. Sorry. Try talking to a few medical professionals. The doctors are being silenced, exactly like the legal profession was while Wall Street grabbed all the homes with fake documents.
But, do continue with listening to what MSM says.
Why are you so worried if you are vaxxed? The people who are NOT worried are the people who have not been vaxxed. Don't you find that interesting?
You ask "Why are you so worried if you're vaxxed"? I'm not. I'm concerned about people who want to get vaxxed, and are unable to, like most people in the Global South. I care about folks who are immunosuppressed including children. Children are winding up in ICU. I care about folks who will get long haul covid if they are lucky, (not dying) and that's no picnic. I guess you don't give a toss about community or facts about vaccinations keeping people out of ICU. You'd rather just throw a tanty about government , even though it's not government that is the issue here. Corrupt governments existed before COVID and they use any disaster to take away rights for the public. That's what they do. Militarised police didn't suddenly come into existence when COVID happened. They have been increasing in Australia since 9/11. Govt and militarised police are a separate issue to the fact that vaccinations keep people out of ICU and will slow down the variant mutations since there will be a smaller and smaller population who will not be contracting it. Yes vaxxed people can carry the virus, that's because we have more mutations. Mutations are naturally occurring in viruses. So while there's huge populations that are unvaxxed, mutations will continue to survive and become more virulent. So one day, you may become a victim of a powerful mutation because your body is not able to deal with it. Remember that next time you go pushing scienceless information.
How awesome that you are connected with all the ICUs across the globe! What a feat!
Do I believe the medical professionals and the doctors being silenced vs the MSM? I believe the medical professionals who tell me the majority of people in hospital with Covid now are vaxxed.
If you wish to believe the lying MSM, go right ahead.
I also note you claim you are the "true left" (in your podcast) but sit here and shame me for my opinions. You are following the totalitarian authoritarian propaganda that the unvaxxed are "uncaring, unloving and generally horrible people." Good on ya.
Unless you think there's a global conspiracy between all the ICUs in the world, then you are simply denying evidence based outcomes in the hospital settings. Okie dokie.
I think there is global propaganda making people, like you, fearful enough that they allow sh*t like what's on these videos to continue.
The recovery rate from the virus is 99.5%. So please continue to be fearful.
Karen, I think you appear to be very committed to intentionally misunderstanding what I am saying to you ( or you have a comprehension problem) which makes me think your engagement with me is in bad faith, so I'm going to leave it here.